Let's keep it civil and on topic if we can...but what are your initial thoughts about the new Esperance release?
I've been playing for a while now so here's my thoughts so far. As basic points based on what is there:
Likes:
Looping works well and is simply implemented.
Beatmixing of mp3's easier with the bpm finder.
Type of file icons quite neat.
Dislikes:
Control buttons for pitch etc very small
Categories are in menus and much harder to navigate.
If I'm honest, there's a couple of things, some negative some positive. We've all used Ots for probably over 10 years, so can give some decent thoughts.
1. I'd have liked a little bit more clarity in the introduction to Esperance. Primary example being I don't know if my library is now compatible between 1.85 and 1.90.
2. I was surprised to see no help files have been written for it on the Ots website- they said they'll get to that. Surely they've had enough time to write and document as they go.
3. The interface is going to take a little bit of getting used to - it appears more DJ suited then radio.
4. I don't like the big hand icon it insists I use.
5. It took me 5 minutes to figure out you need to click on the Ots logo in the top left for the File/Edit/View menu.
6. I love the search just working whenever I type.
7. Delete from list is no longer bottom of the right click option on a file in the playlist - just nearly deleted a load of tracks from my media library.
8. I like the history showing when a track was last played.
9. They've moved the clock from the top right to the left (above dynamics) - I liked it up there :(
10. Showing items per category is really difficult now. If I want to view "A List" I have to click on the down arrow, choose show all items in category, then pick my category.
11. Looping was really easy to pick up on.
That's about it as I get into it. First observations really.
On Kev's point 2 - the help files distributed with the release appear to be newer (e.g the new keyboard shortcuts in 1.90).
My first impression is it is very good - keyboard access to playlist manipulation is improved hugely. I had no issues with installation or my media library. I'll plug in the Numark Total Control in a minute and find out if the OHML format has changed.
It took me a while to work out what the numbers in front of Media Library items was - e.g. 2.2M - it's when it was last played - 2.2 Months in this case.
I'm now wondering how to change the category filters on the drop down list on the left hand side of the Media Library - I mean, how many times will the search "Both Beatles and Love in title/artist" be needed? I'm guessing that these are meant to be defaults that we can change...
I'm sure plenty will post about this, but missing out MPEG-4 is going to cost them a lot of money. They can say they're looking for a way and sugarcoat it with their algorithm all they want, but MPEG-4 is a requirement, not a bonus, for anybody dealing in new music videos now - Too many suppliers offer a better deal for MPEG-4 today.
You can add AAC into that, too - Given iTunes is such a popular store today, and an easy place for a DJ to get a track (even during a show), why hasn't that easy addition been made? Again, the algorithm isn't that hard, and if it is for them then I'm afraid to say they should hire some new talent (brutally honest but true, all other relevant software supports that format).
Most of the changes seem interface related and, to be honest, interface wasn't really one of the things that many were asking to be improved (at least publicly). The ability to run a bigger window is a bonus, however.
Despite the point on video, radio is my main use and it seems obvious to me that their target is now DJs and VJs, because there's very little for the radio lot (including none of the voice tracking and so on). That, of course, begs the question why they'd leave out key things that those people need, because I can't see Esperance doing the bottom line of what it's intended to do - That is, bringing in new users and making Ots Labs money.
Personally I'm content with 1.85 and an upgrade isn't necessary, there's no new features that appeal and it'd just mean learning a new interface.
If you want to complain about what's not there you could go on for ever, best to comment on what is. As far as the radio dj/ vj etc there are very few new features for either only really more playlist features and looping and more awkward interface.
I'm a little annoyed that the scroll function on my mouse pad no longer scrolls the lists.
However its nice to finally see a key change facility (something karaoke singers used to complain to me about not having).
I love the new search immediate functionality... No more clicking the edit box on the search dialog before typing. YEAH! I semi like the new work space. Still playing with it, but I have a feeling I'll prefer it over the older interface.
I looked through the included help files, but it looked to reference the 1.85 version to me. perhaps I need to look more.
IMO, I like the new look, but completely understand the disappointment from others. If they were going to revamp the interface, then why not create a skin interface to allow others to configure to their own needs and desires.
As for the media library, no changes have been made to this yet, so Kev, they are currently compatible, but the next release will likely not be backwards compatible.
As to Kevs point 7, I agree. I too almost deleted tracks from my media library. Glad I got the warning and read it. Once I memorize the keyboard shortcuts, I'll really like this tho.
Hedley, You'd be amazed at how many comments I've heard through the years about the interface. Unfortunately, without skinning, I think the took a small step back.
My gripes aren't many or very large.
Hmm not much if anything for the internet/radio broadcaster that we didn't have before, shame about the drab black/charcoal colour scheme, the size of the decks is something i'll get used to in time with all those extra buttons that I have no use for and again the colour scheme.
And my biggest loss is not being able to have the decks at the bottom.
The search is fine I guess, but then so was the old one as far as I was concerned.
I still love Ots because is just sounds so great and mixes so well without me having to do anything.
Now I just sound like a grumpy old man
Paul.
Looking forward already to the next update as this one really has nothing new for me.
I kind of feel the same. There really isn't that much for the broadcasters. The search functions are cool, but I run an internet station that is mostly automated. I don't really need to find songs "on the fly". The old search functions were fine with me, as was the entire interface. In truth, the only thing I was really looking forward to was proper functioning of the '.' operator. I just want OTS to automatically generate a playlist that separates Dire Straits and Mark Knopfler :icon_lol: It's such a simple thing, but so important to broadcasters, and they've been promising it for a while now. They mentioned in the documentation that it is coming, but what does that mean? Another year?
This is a great product. I've only played with it for about an hour, but I can tell it is rock solid as usual. But it just doesn't suit my needs. I was waiting for this release in order to decide if I need to look elsewhere, and I think I may do that now.
Don't mean to be a pooper. Just a bit disappointed. It certainly was a long wait.
Under the main menu (click the Ots icon) -> View -> Rack Area -> Backdrop you will find three colour schemes:
Black Curtains (default)
Charcoal Grey
Solid Black.
I can understand people dissapointment, but this is a big change for ots and so far I have no gripes, I think once we all get use to it will be better,
This is only the first stage of Esperance I am sure more will come, but it has been said before you can't please all the people all the time.
Yeah, and on the system I tried this out on, there wasn't much difference in the overal look and feel by choosing any of the 3.
I noticed that Jeff couldn't see much of a change
As i stated in my other threat, i'm a little disappointed.
I like the new search options, and the looping functionality.
I absolutely not like the color scheme. it's too dark for me.
I'm color blind and the contrast is too low.
I also would like to see if the Dynamics Processor graphics can be turned of. I do not use it anymore.
I use Breakaway for my gigs.
I'm not using version 1.90 with my gigs, i stay on the old version.
Waiting for the next upgrade 2.0
I've found a negative - You cannot resize the columns in the Media Library - if you have two items that start with the same few characters (e.g. all my Promo Only DVDs are named "Promo Only Chart 2012 07 July" for quick searching on the month) all I can see in the list is "Promo Only Char..." - there's no way of seeing the full title (in the past I would resize the column).
the thing thats bugging me most at the moment,
is that to find a category, you need to click on the down arrow, then click show all items,,
so two clicks needed to get to your list of categories !
if only there was an option to have a proper list of categories to the left,,instead of the output level meter,,
now that would good,,,
cant understand it,,,surely everyone uses categories when they are DJing ???
Ok having used the software for a few hours now as I have a gig on Saturday these are my positive and negative points.
Positive
The new search function is great, much faster and seems not to slow the system down on big library's such as my own.
I love the new decks with the moving pickup arms, gives a visual glimpse that the track is about to end.
The scalability to size the program window is a bonus.
Having a Playlist, Prepare, Library & History window make a huge difference a nice touch.
I now like where the clock has been placed, it fits in well with the layout.
Negative.
One of the most serious issues is the location of the looping controls, they are way way too close to the Eject Button and Load New Track. This has caused me problems already. This needs fixing ASAP.
I have noticed what maybe a bug, when altering the key of a deck whilst a video is playing the video will jitter, pause and play catchup. The audio is unaffected.
The oscilloscope down the bottom of the screen doesn't work, just get a flat line now.
No MPEG-4 support, this is a must. I get all my videos from Promo Only in MPEG-4 format its an ever increasing pain to convert them. MPEG-4 is now the industry standard.
Still no DMX support, would have thought a very simple DMX controller would have been here by now.
Not really a gripe but considering how long we have waited for the upgrade, I don't really see much difference unless there is hidden code in there we don't yet see. As I said not a gripe just an honest observation.
....hang on , whats going on now :)
if you type a song into the search box, it only searches in whatever category you're in ??
that cant be right can it ?
Unfortunately the choice of 3 shades of black does not help when you are in a location where there is a lot of light on the screen (outdoors) where the choices of the other color schemes that were available did help when doing outdoor gigs.
I also miss the option of having the playback decks on either top or bottom (my preference and that of my DJ's was to have them on the bottom).
I had been hoping that we would get a 3rd playback deck and Effects "Hotbuttons" (something I know our radio users also were looking for).
The ability to see 3 different windows related to the Media library is nice. As is the simple "type to search" ability.
I miss having the Categories where you can see them quickly. I use categories for specific items I want on the fly and having to search now, well it is less user friendly than it was in 1.85.
I think that if all the icons were together along the bar, it would make a bit less confusing for some moving from 1.85.
Clicking the upper left icon to get to the menu can be frustrating if you do not know to do so...and some of the things that you once could do, you no longer can do (change deck position, or to a color other than "black or shades thereof").
I will miss the CDDA ability as well. I was close to dumping my CD player totally because of CDDA but with v1.90 if you want to play a song off CD, you will still need a separate unit.
Some of us OtsAV users are older, and the smaller buttons will be hard to transition to. My senior DJ has just asked me NOT to upgrade his unit for this exact reason.
This is going to be my harshest comment...but in the quest to deliver a product that looks more like a popular competitor, I think that Ots lost some of what makes OtsAV the choice of so many here...the ease of use and ease to navigate the software on the fly.
Adding the looping will address one of the requests of members here, but there is soooo much more yet to be done. We are only at v1.90 so we do have a way to go to v2.0.
In the end, some people will be unhappy, some will be happy, and some will be VERY happy with Esperance, and some (like myself) will stay with v1.85 for now.
Oh yeah forgot this one......
What happened to the third deck......?
testing out the trial before i put it on my machines but:
My main thing is not being able to have the decks at the bottom...preference and all...im sure ill get use to it just seems like a strange feature to take out.
also took me awhile to find the file/edit/view item...
seeing as i dont use karaoke, being able to edit, delete, hide that list in favor of a second prepare list etc would be nice...maybe its in there and i just cant find it...let me read the manual.....oh wait.
still getting use to the look...not saying i like/dislike it...just feels a little more video gamey to me...im 50/50 on it.
Yes - you can hide the karaoke list and just have the playlist + media library or you can have three lists playlist + media library + Prepare area - or indeed any combination of the above. You can remove a list with the X button in the top-right corner and add a new one with the + button on any of the lists - that is nice and flexible - a positive addition.
ya with the karaoke list i was just thinking of actually being able to hide the word karaoke or edit that list to say "prepare 2" etc
The karaoke list is still a bit useless - you can't put a singer name against the request. It's a nice idea, but not complete.
Quote from: Darryl on August 01, 2012, 06:24:33 PM
The karaoke list is still a bit useless - you can't put a singer name against the request. It's a nice idea, but not complete.
Thats what Adam or Steve said in the annoncement
i change my mind...
esperance is not actually worth the yearful wait.
But im happy with most of the new feature.
Quote from: Darryl on August 01, 2012, 05:51:43 PM
I've found a negative - You cannot resize the columns in the Media Library - if you have two items that start with the same few characters (e.g. all my Promo Only DVDs are named "Promo Only Chart 2012 07 July" for quick searching on the month) all I can see in the list is "Promo Only Char..." - there's no way of seeing the full title (in the past I would resize the column).
Agree! It would be great to have an option to get a standalone search list/window wich we can resize to full window if needed to find long Artist/Title informations.
Beside that I like the new look and feel :)
I guess we all need to learn and find out all the new features now.
Well I've had Esp fired up for over 7 hours playing a generated playlist and so far it has been rock solid, which is the main reason I and many of us use it, so I feel confident for Saturdays gig. But, there is always a but :icon_lol:, most things have changed places and will need to get use to this but the 2 things that I,m not happy with is 1) everything is black (is that the new in thing) please in the next upgrade bring back the choice of colours and 2) my biggest grip, they have taken away the ability of playing a Cd directly into Esp. This was a very useful tool at events IE majorate com pitions where the contestants brought along their own mixed Cd's etc.
So has the wait been worth it? To be honest to me the answer would no on first real play with it. There was no real in your face screaming thing that jumps out and says I'm back where I belong at the top of the pile. This to me is a reworked 1.85 with some added functions added which will be added to in future upgrades, but I hope we don't have to wait 3-4 years before the next upgrade.
And the main thing it's still ROCK SOLID.
Quote from: Paul Douglas on August 01, 2012, 05:15:34 PM
My gripes aren't many or very large.
Hmm not much if anything for the internet/radio broadcaster that we didn't have before, shame about the drab black/charcoal colour scheme, the size of the decks is something i'll get used to in time with all those extra buttons that I have no use for and again the colour scheme.
And my biggest loss is not being able to have the decks at the bottom.
The search is fine I guess, but then so was the old one as far as I was concerned.
I still love Ots because is just sounds so great and mixes so well without me having to do anything.
Now I just sound like a grumpy old man
Paul.
Looking forward already to the next update as this one really has nothing new for me.
Hi Paul,
I think your comment is really well measured. Not grumpy at all.
It's OK, don't lose faith! And don't assume those little looping buttons are always just for looping ;) Oh, and of course we'll be adding more options for colours, etc, but would you have rather had this in July ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
We're actually really excited about the radio features we've developed and we're quite disappointed ourselves that we had to hold them back from this initial release. But without the media library change it's not possible to store the info we need to store to make them all work. Pushing the media library format change out now *would* have made you all beta testers, as someone else surprisingly tried to suggest of us in another thread. We won't release something that's not good to go. Doesn't mean everything will be perfect or there won't be issues, but hopefully if/when there are they are more in the minor annoyance category than catastrophic.
Re the user interface, it's been our major achillies heel for years. You guys who have been using Ots for years just don't see it because you're used to it and let's face it, if you hated it so much you wouldn't be an Ots user in the first place. But many people don't even give Ots a go because of the dated look. On the other hand, we're still selling OtsTurntables in surprisingly good numbers considering it was developed back in 2003 and hasn't had any substantial upgrades (only Windows compatibility re-issues) and never any feature upgrades! Why? Because people like the look of it. OK, and it's fun, and it's cheap, and you could state other reasons too. But think about it... a 9 year old program that has zero usable searching ability (and no media library as such), hasn't had a single feature update in that entire time span, and yet people still happily part with US$100 for OtsTurntables Pro on a daily basis. The thing is, looks do matter! They don't matter to the sound quality and they don't matter to the ultimate function, but they certainly matter to the emotion of the user (in the overwhelming majority of cases). Because many of you guys either bought Ots back when its looks were still respectable for the time, or if later, perhaps you really are a person who just doesn't give a toss about looks, therefore you don't really see this as an issue. You're used to it, and it does what you like, and that's all great. But why should Ots miss out on a large number of users simply because of dated looks? Think of all those people who could be enjoying the benefits of Ots but aren't given the chance, simply because they're put off at the first look!
We kick ****** in the solution provider market (companies using OtsAV to power background music and video systems for venues, retail outlets, etc). Think about the fact that in many of those cases, there isn't even a monitor connected to the computer running OtsAV, and if so, it's not on. In such cases, sure looks don't matter. But if you want us to remain also focused on the DJ market rather than put all our efforts into the OEM/SP area where we are doing really well, then you have to at least afford us the lattitude to make changes we recognise we have to make in order to capture more of that particular market. You have to look beyond yourself. It applies to us too. We also didn't have a problem with the old look, simply because we were so used to it - just like most of you. But the reality is, market research clearly demonstrates that 1.85 does not win any beauty awards. It's not ugly as much as it's just dated by 2012 standard where iPhones and iPads have become the new kings on the street. We had to either follow the sensible path of accepting this reality or turn our efforts away from the DJ market altogether. I'm sure you're glad we choose to remain! But please try and support our efforts and recognise that ultimately it's good for you, because more users of this type ultimately means more resources can be justified on this area (whether we're talking DJ or radio, doesn't matter).
Jeff made an interesting comment about skinning, which was fair enough on the surface. But trust me when I say this is an area we very deeply looked into. This effort commenced long ago. It's not something you cook up in a few months. If you think deeply about the issues at play, it's actually very complicated to design an interface for this kind of application (where you have fixed units of size, such as decks) and you wish to accommodate the full gamut of display sizes (in our case from 1024 x 600 up to 2560 x 1600) and different features usage (some users use video, which takes quite a bit of room, others are audio only), and keep the app freely resizable *and* at least give the appearance that as little as possible space is being wasted. Skinning doesn't cut it and brings in a whole host of complications on its own. That's why other DJ apps have skins which are purely targeted at one resolution -- too bad if you decide you want to restore the window size, or have to switch from your external monitor to your laptop inbuilt which happens to be smaller and do it all while the program continues to run gracefully without any disruption. We didn't want any of that. And if we had introduced that, no doubt many of you would have found a new thing to complain about ;) Seriously, what we wanted was pure freedom (even the old Ots didn't allow free resizing of the window) to run however you like, on whatever you like - even switching mid-stream - while looking modern and completely polished, even dare I say it, cool, without compromising stability or introducing new unwanted issues. But more than that, we wanted the functional side of things to dramatically improve. This is far more than just a cosmetic overhaul. It's a new user interface which is far better designed and logical than the older. If you don't think so, let's have this conversation in a year. Perhaps even a month will be enough. Do you know how I know? I'll tell you...
Every time ... every *single* time we do something (no matter how positive), people bitch about it. Then after some time they calm down. Then a little after that they see the light and realise how shortsighted they were being. So we completely expected this kind of reaction. But I still feel it's important to explain it for the benefit of perhaps new users, and even to serve as a reminder to older ones. Think about this as a classic example: when Ots first introduced the Media Library and OMQL into OtsDJ around 2002 (obviously very powerful features and vastly superior to what was there before which was simply the ability to randomize an entire folder of songs at startup into the playlist) we had heaps of people complaining about the fact that they could no longer generate a randomized list at startup in the same way. (You can still do this with the Media Library and templates of course, but it all works differently and is way more powerful). So here we had people who just couldn't see the light (at the time) about having a powerful Media Library feature like this. These same people are the biggest advocates of the Media Library today (and indeed I distinctly remember some "lights turning on" even just weeks later as things started to dawn). What would the uproar be if we removed the Media Library and OMQL in the next version? Oh, but it's OK... you can have your simple folder-randomize feature at startup back ;)
The point is... humans absolutely loathe change - EVEN WHEN THAT CHANGE IS GOOD, OR EVEN AWESOME! Of course the clock in the new user interface in 1.90 is in a far more logical position now (hey, it's right near the top of the time column for the playlist, and they're the two things you'd normally be comparing times for), but even that simple change has been criticized (sorry Matt!). It's not personal of course. We understand it. Matt is just so used to seeing the clock floating in a really weird position somewhere between the tool bar and the minimize box, that when order is introduced and it gets installed in a far more logical and practical (and stable) position, neurons in the brain begin firing and screaming "NO!! NO!!! STOP IT!! I CAN'T". But let's ask Matt (or anyone else - I only use Matt because it's a very nice simple example I just read of what I'm talking about) to come back in say 6 months (or maybe even far earlier) after having run 1.90 and then go and run 1.85 and give his honest opinion. Of course we can't speak for Matt or anyone specific. But if I had to put money on it (which in fact I am, by having steered the company this way!) I know where my bets would lie. Give it time. That's the moral.
Let Ots do what they have to do. Trust us. We've invested thousands upon thousands of man hours into an area, conducted extensive research, etc. Don't you think that's going to count for something, compared to an off-the-cuff opinion of someone (anyone - could be me with the shoe on the other foot) that's just seen something for a matter of hours?
Basically what I'm saying is that YOU WILL LIKE THIS! You just may not know it yet. I can say that relatively confidently because I've been in this situation countless times before and it always ends the same. You know, even when we introduced video in 2006 there were whingers. Same (very much so, in fact) with ABM. But can you imagine the uproar if we suddenly removed ABM now! I realise not everyone uses every single feature, but that's not the point. People do use all these features and they have to be implemented logically and with order (at least that's our goal - of course it's not always possible to hit the post perfectly).
So, if you take my premise that you're eventually going to not just like, but really LOVE this stuff - in a relatively short time from now, then can we just skip all this wasteful beginning part and focus on what the changes actually are in a positive manner and on actually embracing them? That would be easier, more pleasant and more efficient for everyone. Of course if you *really* *really* hate something SO much then you'll go somewhere else. I'm not trying to presume anything here, just recalling what I've seen over the many years. And I hardly think any of you are in the hate category. So what do you say, let's just get on with it 'eh?
Don't care about what features were or weren't in *this* release. Many of the proposed ideas thrown around were people's own dreams anyway - nothing Ots ever stated. We clearly can't do everything everyone wants. But then neither can other apps, otherwise they'd have captured your full attention by now and you wouldn't be wasting any time around here. So enjoy what you have, enjoy the new things that come your way (1.90.000) and look forward to what's to come - further Esperance releases. (You never know, something planned for one of the future releases might be the very idea you're really wanting.)
Take care guys, and please, keep talking... after so much effort put into this for such a long time, it's quite fun for our guys reading the various comments. Sure, some posts come across a little harsh, rushed, or unjust, but we'll try to overlook that. We know you're all really nice guys underneath the surface ;)
A.
Adam,
Thanks for the post! I for one already LOVE Esperance. And, if you look at some of my other posts, I tried to leave Ots for other software because I am a Mac guy. I loathe Windows. I thought I found something I could live with and then the controller kept locking up on me. I have NEVER had one single issue with Ots. If you guys ever do release a Mac version, my life will be complete. :P
But, I mean, think about that in and of itself... the ONLY software I use on Windows is OtsAV ... but it's THAT good. The rest just don't stack up.
As far as Esperance, I think it's amazing. I like the clock placement and the decks and the turntables. I love how the play and cue buttons are red & green (similar to real decks). The search method is incredible and the looping is very good too. One question on looping (for Adam or anyone who's played with Esperance with an HC4500). I have a 4500 on the way, but I won't have it for a few days, so I'm wondering something: once you start a loop, can you extend or shrink the loop? Or is this to come in an update? Otherwise, I'm a happy camper. It can only get better, right?
Excellent responce as usual Adam.
It did feel stange at first but as you say you quickly get into it, I am really pleased with the new look,and even in the short time of using Esperance getting use to it is no problem.
i will also hold back from "upgrading" to the new version..at the moment though..
as stated we all have our "wishlist " so to speak..and i'm sure they will be adressed at some point.
this release has been roughly two years in the making..and some difficult obstacles had to be overcome.
i'm taking it for granted that the base code of the program has been overhauled to allow the new features in esperance to function..and most importantly to give the program ability to add other features in the future.
i'm in no way downbeat about the upgrade and i'm sure any criticisms have been take on board..specifically about THIS release..
not future releases or would be future functions...
on my part, for those who embrace this release, enjoy...
myself..i'm looking forward to further features that will attract me to spend my cash on an upgrade that presses the buttons for me.
please don't make it so long between upgrades..thats all i ask.
:thumbsup:
Thansk Adam. Very eloquently put may I say.
One question for someone, rather than display the full library on each startup, is there a way I can display one particular category on startup as default? I can't find how you display categories.
Thanks for the recent communication, that has been my biggest gripe for ten years, seems to be improving of late and that's a good thing, on to Esperance...
-I absolutely love the new color scheme, though I see why some wouldn't
-The new search interface is nifty
-I'm not crazy about the smaller cover art unless it's moused over, maybe there's a way to change I'm not seeing yet, as was stated earlier, LOOKS MATTER!
Quote from: Mike Sinclair on August 01, 2012, 07:46:38 PM
Adam,
Thanks for the post! I for one already LOVE Esperance. And, if you look at some of my other posts, I tried to leave Ots for other software because I am a Mac guy. I loathe Windows. I thought I found something I could live with and then the controller kept locking up on me. I have NEVER had one single issue with Ots. If you guys ever do release a Mac version, my life will be complete. :P
But, I mean, think about that in and of itself... the ONLY software I use on Windows is OtsAV ... but it's THAT good. The rest just don't stack up.
As far as Esperance, I think it's amazing. I like the clock placement and the decks and the turntables. I love how the play and cue buttons are red & green (similar to real decks). The search method is incredible and the looping is very good too. One question on looping (for Adam or anyone who's played with Esperance with an HC4500). I have a 4500 on the way, but I won't have it for a few days, so I'm wondering something: once you start a loop, can you extend or shrink the loop? Or is this to come in an update? Otherwise, I'm a happy camper. It can only get better, right?
Thanks heaps Mike and Jigger.
Mike, yes, that does make us feel fairly proud of our efforts. I'm aware of a few other people in your category - running Windows just for OtsAV. We'd love to make a Mac version as such, but the truth is the market (niche within a niche) just doesn't justify it. That's sad, but it's true. On the other hand, I've thought about clever ways to port OtsAV across to the Mac using techniques such as Wine (which I'm sure you're familiar with). None of them would rival a native app however, but who knows? It may still work very well. Ots is fairly efficient. But then you'd have to ask yourself, is the ability to run within OS X (to avoid the time/hassle in switching over to Windows each time) worth it to you in the lost performance you'd get since operating system calls would all essentially be being emulated?
Re the looping question, you can't currently shrink and expand loops on the fly, but that's definitely coming soon. Our underlying engine can do it and it's very cool :)
Thanks again for your positivity. It's very pleasing/rewarding for us folk here to hear those sentiments.
Cheers,
A.
Quote from: JohnnyTheFox on August 01, 2012, 07:53:47 PM
Thansk Adam. Very eloquently put may I say.
One question for someone, rather than display the full library on each startup, is there a way I can display one particular category on startup as default? I can't find how you display categories.
Thanks Johnny, you can't in this version - but they're the kinds of things we'll be adding. Simple and logical and very useful.
Regards,
A.
Further to the above, on re-reading your question it appears that maybe you are also asking how to display categories in general - not just in startup. I take it you're aware of the button menu to the left of the "OMQL" field. The first option in this is a submenu that contains all categories. Click one of these, and the view will be limited to just that category. You can equally as well just type the cat name into the OMQL field. It's the same thing really.
And, that's awesome too. How many software companies jump on a forum after a release and immediately answer questions? Ots Corp is a class act.
Honestly Adam, I have no problem using a Windows laptop to run Ots. I've surrendered to the fact that Ots is my software of choice and it happens to be windows-based. I picked up a Dell Ultrabook with in i5 processor and it's a nice little computer.
Thanks again!
no one else got any views on the category and search situation ???
unless I'm doing something completely wrong, it seems bonkers to me,,,,
let me explain;
firstly, its pita to have to click on two different places just to get the category you want.
and then it seems you can't do a general search whilst you are in a category
you have to go out of that category first..
surely thats crazy !
i must be doing something wrong :wacko:
there must be some DJs on here who have a view on this or can explain what im doing wrong,,,
I mean I take it you all use categories when your dj ing .....
PS> I really like the look of it by the way, does look cool..
Quote from: jeff wood on August 01, 2012, 08:15:48 PM
no one else got any views on the category and search situation ???
unless I'm doing something completely wrong, it seems bonkers to me,,,,
let me explain;
firstly, its pita to have to click on two different places just to get the category you want.
and then it seems you can't do a general search whilst you are in a category
you have to go out of that category first..
surely thats crazy !
i must be doing something wrong :wacko:
there must be some DJs on here who have a view on this or can explain what im doing wrong,,,
I mean I take it you all use categories when your dj ing .....
PS> I really like the look of it by the way, does look cool..
Hi Jeff,
I'm not sure I understand the problem you are having. You can select a category using the dropdown menu (button to the left of OMQL field) and chosing the submenu in it (top) which displays all categories and you obivously pick one. But this is just a simple feature to aid the understanding of how categories work - they really just place the selected category name in the OMQL field. All the power is in OMQL. This was the same in 1.85 - when you picked from the dropdown list, the cat name would be placed in the field.
If your cat names are generally nice and short, it's far easier just to type to enter queries. Personally I always do this. Of course the list (menu) does still serve a useful purpose of reminding you what your category names actually are, for those moments when you're not even really sure what you're doing or wanting.
But all in all, unless you really need to rely on the mouse (comfort reasons or maybe something else), I'd at least suggest trying to retrain yourself to use the keyboard more. It's actually way faster in most cases, unless you have ridiculously long cat names or something. Plus when you use the list (doesn't matter whether we're talking 1.90 or the older 1.85), you are always limited to just the one cat.
If you use the keyboard, you can instantly do cool things like:
pop&rock
and you'll see everything that's in the pop AND rock category, or
pop|rock
for things that are in pop OR rock (ie. doesn't have to be both).
This becomes really powerful, and when you combine it with other things such as the 'bpm' keyword, 'lastplay' and others, you really have a lot of cool tools at your disposal.
If "pop&rock" doesn't seem intuitve to you, you can also type "pop & rock" or even "pop and rock" and all variations will produce exactly the same results. But the thing is, "pop&rock" is the least amount of keystrokes (which means, faster!) and once you get the & and | symbols clearly in your head and their meanings, you'll find yourself blasting out OMQL in your sleep.
Who needs a slow menu driven by the mouse?
But seriously, of course we recognise that some people are way more comfortable that way, and that's why we placed that option in the menu. We will most likely make further enhancements to this area, and yes, there may well be a wall of buttons for each category at some stage. That kind of thing is not a bad idea as such - but mostly for ease of use and discovery for new users. Since you're seasoned, see how you go giving those keywords ago I mentioned earlier.
Hope that helps :)
A.
Thanks Adam for answering some of the questions asked in this thread and other threads on this forum. I'm glad you are looking into the colour schemes, this was one of my gripes, but I still can't see why you have taken out the ability of importing a Cd into Esp. You are saying it is old technology but to me it is useful to have when presented with a Cd track to play at a gig. There is no way I'm going to rip it into studio whilst doing a gig and without taking a CD player I'm stuffed.
Quote from: Ots_Adam on August 01, 2012, 08:10:37 PM
Further to the above, on re-reading your question it appears that maybe you are also asking how to display categories in general - not just in startup. I take it you're aware of the button menu to the left of the "OMQL" field. The first option in this is a submenu that contains all categories. Click one of these, and the view will be limited to just that category. You can equally as well just type the cat name into the OMQL field. It's the same thing really.
That's exactly what I was after. Thanks Adam. I missed that button.
I'm happy and echo the thoughts on another thread, what other software company would be on hand on an unofficial forum to answer questions like this? More power to your elbow Ots! Much appreciated.
Quote from: Darryl on August 01, 2012, 05:51:43 PM
I've found a negative - You cannot resize the columns in the Media Library - if you have two items that start with the same few characters (e.g. all my Promo Only DVDs are named "Promo Only Chart 2012 07 July" for quick searching on the month) all I can see in the list is "Promo Only Char..." - there's no way of seeing the full title (in the past I would resize the column).
Hi Darryl
From what I can see there is no need for you to type "promo only Chart "for everything that is just bloating your system I just abbreviate mine as much as poss say, to POC1207.
I was disappointed not to see a highly desirable Configurable text placeholder which would have the ability to keep a note between tracks for say music video and key settings , useful for everyone. and the biggest omission was in my opinion the ability to save graphic equaliser settings for different venues or for punching out different genres perhaps even storing the eq in the ots studio file .
Also someone once said ots did not plan to have lighting control well there is a lighting control chunk greyed out in Ots studio been there a long time.
Everything else is great but it to me is more like a revamp than an upgrade.
The most important thing was previously mentioned and that is the lack of Documentation to accompany the release , there can be no excuse as these changes have taken sooooo long that even the tea boy could have written a manual for this , I am happy to use ots for ever exclusively , but sad that some of the simple omissions were made. I think someone suggested colours for the tracks so that the genres of the songs could be instantly seen was a suggestion I made years ago.and would have been no problem to program in. shame because it would have given us a bit more in what has turned out to be a pretty average christmas stocking.
Quote from: Jigger on August 01, 2012, 06:36:45 PM
Thats what Adam or Steve said in the annoncement
I appreciate that Ron. It wasn't meant as a dig, it was just an observation (as it stands it doesn't add much value).
Well done OTS - I like it in the main. 1.85 did what it said on the box and so does 1.90 but just in a different way and because of the change questions will come.
* I am sure more colour options will be built in (black is not colour of choice)
* Media columns are not sizable - maybe a popup when the mouse hovers would be useful
* I did like the larger album cover but that was just for the DJ
* The deck arm was good to show the play position but as I dont scratch I have use the option to hide the two decks so I am left with the slightly smaller deck time & coundown clocks
* I use the "^" to denote a 7inch and "^^" for 12inch version in the track title and now this plays up with the search so I think I can get around it by searching for "^" (using the inverted commas) or [^] as it is on the 2nd line of the title
By the way these are comments not likes or dislikes -- it all changed and I am on board for the next installment :thumbsup:
So far I really like it.
As Adam said, I'm used to the old look, and didn't have a problem with it, but can see how new users would find it "cooler"
I like having more columns when I need them.
Seeing when the song was played last is great
Clock position makes great sense
Maybe in the future we could have a choice of buttons, so if someone isn't using looping, for example, those buttons could be hidden and the buttons needed could be larger...just a thought
Having played with it for a while, it's certainly growing on me. I've had to make some changes to my Karaoke Hoster to because it made assumptions about the user interface, but that's no bad thing (and certainly not a criticism of Ots Labs - I knew the risks of bolting on this functionality all along and that Ots Labs could change the UI at any time).
I'm liking the new keyboard friendly approach - it's a bit of a learning curve e.g. <Ctrl>+<Del> to remove an item from the playlist for instance (but perfectly sensible since you might want to use <Del> when typing in the media library).
The media library search seems considerably faster. I'd still like a simple karaoke/music switch - i.e. only show karaoke or only show non-karaoke items, but that's just me being fussy!
I might be renaming some of my categories for even quicker access soon.
I would like to apologise about my last post after I read it It sounded a little Harsh, I felt guilty about what i wrote just especially after reading Adams post.and feeling his comitment.
Everyone knows Ots is a fantastic product ,
it is highly undervalued , under appreciated and just to say that It is not any of the changes that bother me at all, it is just that sometimes as customers we need to justify having waiting quivering with anticipation for a long time, and some of the tiniest new features requiring virtually minimal programming could have satisfied even the most critical user. even something as simply as a the background colour of the screen.
I dont really have the right to comment negatively at all as I have been a Dj for 39 years and Ots has been THE best,and MOST RELIABLE tool , yes tool, that I have EVER Used, and I have purchased over 8 differnt software packages, NONE of them Stack up to OTS.
If Ots DJ was double the price it would Still be Incredible value for money, as it is the central part of my show and it is only evrything elese that is a worry, certainly not Ots.
anyway that's enough scraping for now. DONT put the price up because of me or I will have to leave the Earth and settle somewhere else.
Getting abit confused with omql. If I type in main tunes (one of my cats) it won't show but if I type "main tunes" it shows all the tunes in that cat. Type another cat 80 without the " " it shows all the tunes. It seems that some show without " " and others I've got to use " ".
I've managed to break my toolbar buttons. None of them are working. They worked earlier because I used the Audio Output Configuration button to change the sound to the HDMI output. I've quit the program and reloaded it, but still no joy. Any ideas?
Quote from: mel garland on August 01, 2012, 09:26:02 PM
Getting abit confused with omql. If I type in main tunes (one of my cats) it won't show but if I type "main tunes" it shows all the tunes in that cat. Type another cat 80 without the " " it shows all the tunes. It seems that some show without " " and others I've got to use " ".
Any categories with spaces in them have to be enclosed in quotes. Its because the language uses spaces to separate operators from each other. If it annoys you too much you can rename the categories to remove the space - the underscore character is one option - i.e. main_tunes.
Thanks Darryl I had a feeling you would answer my question.
hey darryl try loading the 1.90 demo install into c:\otsdemo NOT otslabs
and see if the toolbars work then . that will tell you if its hardware or software.
i am running the demo on the same pc as my ots 185
and they both work ok even at the same time !!!
Jeff's or Darryl's (I can't remember which of these two geniuses put it together) AHK script for "currently playing" seems to have stopped working :ohmy:
My main question surrounds who this update was created for.
Sadly I am disappointed with what you've delivered in regards to search system, hate to tell you but other software products have made a "MUCH" better approach to this, Get rid of the Dynamics processor display and make a category list in the library similar to the file browser the Virtual DJ has instead with the categories list.
The library in its new form is to small and unable to resize the aliments of the library seems a little odd.
If your main market in the future is the retail background music market you would need to make simple style of interface for that to work.
Ask yourself this question. Who are the most loyal of our customers?
It is obvious you are trying to compete with Nite life in running a full Audio Visual software package but the more demand is coming from DJs and broadcasters, snubbing the loyalists is not a commercial decision business's take lightly however i would think that you need to consider the impact the bad publicity that will come from the most loyal people as it is already showing.
Stability in my opinion is no longer the big ticket item people are looking for, they are looking for features and benefits of those feature.
In the wash up of the release I would say the look is better but feature are just rebadged to suit the new look.
From a commercial point of view the biggest mistake you made was not preview features or screen shots were released, this could explain the backlash you now are facing.
Cheers
Just my thoughts
doesnt seem to recognise numbers neither, eg 90's,
so far i think its crazy,,,
give me a list of cats and a mouse click anyday,,
looks like it's 1.85 for me I'm afraid :angry1:
is it possible to use the nob on the denon 4500 to go up & down the library like you can with the play list ???
Darryl have you updated your host as i us it or dose it still work ?
To be honest, It looks more like a "DJ" program now more than ever. And what happened to Ots and there radio like stuff? I see no new feats for radio
. Thinking of just using 1.85 or selling my license .. other that that it's ok. No new feats for radio at all and I run a radio station on which I could have benefited from.
Hi Jeff,
I'm working on an update to the Karaoke Hoster to work with Esperance. It's nearly working, but I've got other problems with my laptop now - just rebooted (trying to get the toolbar in OtsAV working again) and it took over 4 minutes - very odd.
Quote from: Stress_Magnet on August 01, 2012, 08:43:37 PM
The most important thing was previously mentioned and that is the lack of Documentation to accompany the release , there can be no excuse as these changes have taken sooooo long that even the tea boy could have written a manual for this , I am happy to use ots for ever exclusively , but sad that some of the simple omissions were made.
I'm sorry, but that's a really unfair comment. How do you know what goes on at Ots Labs? Do you know the reasons for this release taking sooooooo long as you put it? Many of us didn't sleep for two days straight in order to make this deadline. For me personally, I still haven't - and the release went out almost 12 hours ago.
Why not take a different approach for once? How about saying "Wow, this is great. Ots Labs drew a line in the sand and said they would deliver this before the end of July - and hey, they did - terrific"? Instead the best you can do is complain about waiting a few extra hours for some documentation. At least you get to play, you have it. If we hadn't have put it out by the "deadline" because we were overly caring about getting the docs in line with what made final release as our number one priority, what would your comment have been then? It begs the question doesn't it?
The point is, Ots did everything within its power, even going to unreasonable personal efforts in order to make this happen. How about some appreciation for that fact? We didn't *have* to do anything. We did it because we value our word. At no point did we state that the release would be fully polished, perfect and complete in every facet. In fact we even went out of our way to state the opposite - we said that even if we have to drop things, we'll get this out within said timeframe. Seems a bit trifle to be complaining about docs just 11 hours after it went out, wouldn't you think? We are people too.
Many of the things in the release are pretty intuitive anyway - especially when combined with the description that was published at www.otsav.com/esperance/ Sure, it will be great to have some basic docs to explain the new functionality to tide things over until when our entire OtsAV docs are completely overhauled for Esperance. But it's not exactly fair to dump on us for that. We stated that it would take a while for some things to catch up. Making a comment like the tea boy could have written it demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of how this industry works. Should the tea boy have written the software too?
Have you seen the "preliminary" or sometimes even non-existent documentation we often have to put up with from Microsoft on a regular basis? The world isn't perfect. That's certainly true. But Ots did deliver Esperance, and within the timeframe they said they would. That's also true. I'm not personally in favour of any more of these deadline-type scenarios. And it only makes it worse when people focus on the "what's missings" rather than the "what's theres".
OK, I've had my rant. And I apologise. It's not personal - I realise anyone could have equally made a similar comment to you and probably fairly innocently so. But it's not a bad thing for you guys to get some real understanding of the pain that we go through. All this talk about "Ots deliberately stalling until midnight". Yeah, right.
Cheers,
Adam
hi ADAM
is it possible to use the parameters knob on the denon 4500 to scroll up & down the library ?
Quote from: JohnnyTheFox on August 01, 2012, 09:37:15 PM
Jeff's or Darryl's (I can't remember which of these two geniuses put it together) AHK script for "currently playing" seems to have stopped working :ohmy:
Do you have a link to the script?
Quote from: Artist formerly known as 'Jumpin' Jeff' on August 01, 2012, 10:01:51 PM
Do you have a link to the script?
Can't find the link to the script on here but here is an upload. It seems to have been prepared by Robbie1876
[attachment deleted by admin]
Quote from: JohnnyTheFox on August 01, 2012, 10:17:06 PM
Can't find the link to the script on here but here is an upload. It seems to have been prepared by Robbie1876
i don't whether the Defines.ahk may need changing?
Anyone tried the new version with the HC4500 and tried the scroll know in the library?
not been able to scroll the library but you can the play list / history /karaoke prepare
What about the looping?
Adam
If its worth having its worth fighting for that's all we are doing fighting for Ots, You HAVE worked hard You Have supplied OTS which Has met most every need thus far, can you blame anyone for being Disappointed with the quantity..... NOT... Dissatisfied by any means with the quality.
There is a huge, huge Difference
I for one, am an Ots Junkie and am forever checking email and websites for additional goodies
probably (O.C.D)
and it is not my fault that I like your product and cannot get enough of it, just the same as everyone else out there.
I wasn't bashing Ots, or the tea boy in my post , that was just a figure of speech See post #49 where i realised how harsh i was before you told me off in post #61.
:rolleyes:
I Know We are all absolutely happy with ots, not only because because what you have done is sheer genius, but we are all little boys at heart, and once you showed us the best we now only want the best and will clamour for more because we are addicted to OTS.
It IS your fault really, as you have created a huge demand . We love ots and all have different ideas what we would like it to incorporate which is fair enough, we are also investors after all. Ha Ha
We dont mean to be demanding but just hope some of our ideas will be useful to you as we are mainly djs showmen and presenters, most of us dont do software, but we have a reasonable idea what we would like to have in our musical arsenals,even though we cant even program the TV remote. :unsure:
Once again for what its worth I totally applaud you and the OTS team, you have done a fantastic job but we all love our toys and OTS is one of the best, so naturally we, just like baby birds with a tasty worm are not happy with just the one meal, but we all love OTS and you too Adam, hope the rant got rid of some of your stress.
I really hope I didnt offend you with my comments but remember that it isn't criticism you are getting from most people, it is mere disappointment because we will never be satisfied until we have the Whole nine yards.
A Human Quality!!!
Accept my apologies once again Adam have a sleep,a pat on the back and Crack on please LoL :thumbsup:
Having had a bit of a play with searches I now see the reason for the search system, it just takes some getting used to.
What I would suggest is create a forum here with the tittle of search help tips.
djnpd - re: looping: I haven't got enough spare buttons on my cheap controller to try it (unless I take off some other functionality to give it a go). The HC4500 implementation uses the flip, a1, a2 and exit buttons if that helps.
Different things happen if flip is held, exit is held or both are held when you press the a1 or a2 buttons.
It isn't too obvious from just looking the code - I think we need a HC4500 owner to try it.
Adam - agreed with those above. Go get yourself a WELL deserved beer. It's sad that there are so many in the DJ industry who 'want want want'. I'm a very active DJ in the evenings, but work as a video editor in the daytime, and I'll say, aside from the rock solid stability, easy of use, awesome auto-mix features and everything else, OTS has been absolutely amazing for the fact that, if you were an early adopter, you're still getting (and have gotten) most of these updates free of charge. AND, the cost of the software is STILL low today for what it does. Yea, there are other pieces of DJ software that do other things and are similar and around the same price/cheaper/etc - but I for one am of the belief that offering these pieces of software at such low prices is one of the biggest problems the industry has (in the mobile industry at least), due to the fact that so many expect everything for literally NO money.
I pay at least 2k USD a year to update my video and imaging software to be current, and do so because i have to. Many others are still going on a $350 or less purchase with multiple updates. Not that i mind the fact that OTS is more affordable, but OTS is simply the SINGLE most used piece of 'equipment' that i own. EVERY single event I do, I utilize OTS. Speakers, amps, mixers, etc. may come and go, but OTS is the real hero, and I'd be willing to pay for each and every upgrade (maybe that would stop some of the complainers too, eh? If you guys just call this release 2.0, then update from there and make everyone pay for their upgrade, they'll have nothing to complain about... they'd have to buy it to complain!) -- i know it's more complicated than that, but you get the point
Now that that's over, i will say that I am overall pleased with the many new features of the release and appreciate the hard work that went into this. I may have a few things that 'I would have done different', but dont we all? At the end of the day it comes down to usability and reliability, both of which are very well focused on in this release, as it has been the standard for every other release.
With that said, I've read there is exploration for the support of other video formats, but is there anything else that can be given about H.264 support? Obviously this has quickly become the industry standard for DJs and beyond. Is it licensing for the codecs? Are there conversion problems? Concerns about quality? This is my only 'real' disappointment, albeit slight, as I have no problem doing the MPEG4-MPEG2 conversion dance before heading into OTS, just an extra step is all.
Other than that, to reiterate, I truly appreciate the hard work and sticking true to the 'line in the sand' for delivery... and deliver you did! There's still more to come too and i look forward to it all! But this is enough to at least get the gears rolling again and be able to be even more creative behind the wheels of steel! (or plastic as they are on my 4500 :-)
Cheers Adam! And the rest of the Ots Crew!
I hate to be the doom monger here tonight, but I've found another cosmetic defect - when dragging the 'thumb' in the scrollbar if you accidentally move the mouse off the side of the OtsAV UI into the video overlay, the hand icon is visible over the top of the video overlay.
My initial thoughts are that I have events this week-end, next week-end, and the week-end after that which have all of my computers tied up... Until I get a break in my schedule allowing one of my machines to be open for a week-end, I will still be running 1.85... (Life without a net sucks...)
What I have right now is stable... (I am sure 1.90 is just as stable) This decision is not made by my fear of the software, but by my fear of my IT guy's skills... I am my companies IT guy... I am not that good... LOL... I will have to live vicariously through you guys in the mean time...
That, and I can watch as the knowledge base builds up on this release minimizing my learning curve...
My guys have to be trained on the new features... That will take a few sessions... What I learn here in this forum will be VALUABLE!!!
To Adam & the rest of the team... THANK YOU for delivering the product on this timetable... The only feature I was looking for was looping... THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, FOR LOOPING!!! The fact that you after being up for a few days without rest speaks volume as to the character of you and the rest of your team!!!
Get some rest (and a beer...)
Daryl,
I just checked the MIDI map for the HC4500 and it appears the looping is active but I will connect the gig rig machine and find it out later.
Quote from: JohnnyTheFox on August 01, 2012, 10:19:14 PM
i don't whether the Defines.ahk may need changing?
I don't see where this script is using my defines file. Perhaps Robbie can look into it as it's his script.
I'm sure I just skipped through it but what is the upgrade price and does anyone have any photos
Hi Adam,
First off, sleep and drink!
Secondly, purely for us who are geeks and code...what's behind the scenes on the new version? Still assembly code and Win32? Or some new stuff too?
Nothing to complain about here...absorbing everything...there will be questions but for now I'd like to thank you for your efforts and point out that the harsh posts are purely from peoples passion for the product. If that's what you can stir up with lines of code then good on you!
Thanks
G
Quote from: nextgen1 on August 01, 2012, 11:41:26 PM
I'm sure I just skipped through it but what is the upgrade price and does anyone have any photos
Hello Dave,
I'm not sure they announced the price yet
Just Spent 4 hours playing with the new free trial version I'm sold will buy when funds allow even at full price this a super program that is top notch for performance . Take a Bow Ots Labs this is just right and will get even better as time allows for the platform to develop .
Snowman :thumbsup:
Thanks guys!
And no worries at all Brian. I did see your apology post after my rant post - and then I felt a little bad for my post ;) Exactly what happened to you in reverse!
But as I tried to make clear at the end of my post, it wasn't really personal to you as such even though that was definitely the triggger. I pointed out that anyone could have said a similar thing, and quite innocently (or what I mean by that is without any malicious intent). I guess I just think it's good if you guys realise that we are human too and it's not all a big game like some may like to imagine.
I noticed a number of comments - maybe it was more on Facebook - suggesting that we were simply waiting around to the end of the month to poke fun at people. Some people must have a lot of time on their hands and a great imagination. Why would we wait? If we could have released on the 30th, we would have. If we could have on the 15th, we would have. If we could have in June, we would have. I can assure everyone there is absolutely no game. We take what we do very seriously. If we didn't, there's no way anyone in our position would bother with all the crap we have to put up with in order to bring such a complicated beast and its associated products to market.
But yeah, passion is a great thing really. So bring it on guys. I'll disappear shortly anyway. I've now been up for a record of hours straight! (And that's a big thing for me, because I regularly stay up very long hours - but 57 hours without any sleep or stopping whatsoever breaks my previous record of 54 - hmmmm, slightly proud of that, maybe I'll even hit 60 today!).
Thanks Gar, but I like to drink then sleep (when I eventually sleep, that is!) rather than the other way around. Yeah, still using our proven and trusty methods of coding. There's some interesting "new" stuff out there, but there's also a lot of pitfalls and issues with much of it. For a realtime performance critical audio/video app like Ots, you can't beat the real thing. Now if we were coding a graph display system, things *may* be different.
Take care guys. Time for another drink.
A.
The "Remove From List" needs to be moved! It is much to important and serious to place it where a simple mistake could lead to disaster! I almost removed 130,000 songs from the ML !!
I have also had a couple of hangs today (I think, i'm not certain what I did). Ots has never frozen on me before.
Over time I will figure out 1.90.
Please don't make us wait two years for the next upgrade; in fact, not even two months is my hope, and yes my prayer.
Gordon
www.Memory-MakerDJs.com
Looking at the update from an AutoHotKey point of view, I wonder if this release will allow more possibilities with scripting..?
Or I wonder if the menu changes mean some scripts just wont work anymore.
Shall be interesting to see what comes out of the Control Scrips Forum
mmmm well what can I say - very different layout - first visual impression - HATE IT...... Could not get any of my full licenses activated so using temp license.
Got a audio glitch when sliding the scroll list up and down on my newish I3 laptop.
Is it me or it's really harder to search for songs and catagories!!!!!!!!!! What happened to the Deck Positioning???? I use it the other way (decks on bottom)
I suppose with all new things it just takes a bit of getting use to. I will not be using this version this weekend for my weddings until 100% tested and know where all my buttons.
Looping is cool on my HC-4500 - nice one
No point testing it with my MC-6000 console as I can not see a new OHM file in the folder...................
Just used it with the HC4500, worked OK but just a warning for poeple who have never tried looping before, you need to ride the loop with the jog wheel just like you would if where looping with two CD players.
The only issue I see and I'm sure one of the boys can fix it. The loop lights on the HC4500 do not work in looping mode, just something to be aware, apart from that it worked well.
I did notice when i turned OTS off the play and cue buttons stayed on.
Quote from: djnpd on August 02, 2012, 02:43:39 AM
Just used it with the HC4500, worked OK but just a warning for poeple who have never tried looping before, you need to ride the loop with the jog wheel just like you would if where looping with two CD players.
The only issue I see and I'm sure one of the boys can fix it. The loop lights on the HC4500 do not work in looping mode, just something to be aware, apart from that it worked well.
I did notice when i turned OTS off the play and cue buttons stayed on.
yep I also noticed the HC-4500 buttons still active when OTS is closed down.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE Adam next update put the option to have yer decks on the bottom..................
The biggest annoyance is the black background. My eyes have problems with black backgrounds - everything starts to get blurry and my eyes start to hurt.
I avoid websites and programs with black (dark) backgrounds.
I could only look at my computer screen for about 3 minutes before minimizing the new OTS program and it took another 5 minutes for my eyes to refocus themselves.
It is a shame that there are no other color choices as in the previous versions...
I guess I'll wait for a later update to see if this is resolved.
well Ive had a really good play with it now :rolleyes:
and whilst there's a lot of things I do really like about it,, BUT I just cannot live with having to type in the name of the category that I want.
it's funny, one of the down points of OTS (for me) was that there was only 6 categories on display,,,and I was hoping that on this release there would be more ! but, as it happens there now isn't any !
reading the comments on this thread is making me wonder; are any of you (including adam) actually DJ's ????
surely the MOST important feature of all is to be able to quickly click on whatever category (genre) you want ...
so to have to click on two places before you even get to your categories is a joke,
forget the other method,,,who's gonna want to type in the whole name of the category everytime they want to choose a category ???
and then,,,to make matters worse,,, when you want to do a global search (ie from your whole collection), , you have to exit whatever category you were in,,and then youve got the hassle of going back to it.
I'm quite a hands on DJ,, I'm always changing the category that I'm working off, and I even use the category list to help me decide genre of music I'm going to play.
So, after given it a lot of thought, I will be sticking with 1.85.
This release for me isn't gonna work.
What I just dont get ..
Is why on earth cant you just have a category list on the left,,ie why the output level display is,,,that is all thats needed !
Even my ancient PCDJ red 5.2 had a lovely category display on the left,,,,surely thats not too much to ask is it ???
Hi Jeff, I can understand your frustration when you hope a specific feature will be included/improved upon and just doesn't work for you or seem to make sense. But, is this really so much of an issue that you won't upgrade? I've had about 2 hours to play with it and am totally loving the new search capability. I'm also a category button-masher so I would love to have a single button to click on for either categories or custom stored searches, but I think that is something they will add in the near future (as long as we offer it as a compelling option). Check out their new search list that provides basically this functionality via a drop-down list (click on the down-arrow to the left of the OMQL tab), it just isn't customizable yet - now take that and make into a button group over top of the dynamics/output display - problem solved.
And just so you know, when doing global searches you just need to right-click on the down-arrow mentioned above (it will reset the search box - found this out because of the awesome new pop-up tool-tips) then when you are done your search click the back-arrow just above the down-arrow to go back to where you were. Give it a shot, but keep in mind this is the first of the v1.9 software and some updates should be just around the corner. Let's keep the fingers crossed that you get something that works with your work-flow.
Thanks for the reply Dr J
But I wouldnt describe the categories as a specific feature ..
ie, in the same way that lots of people here have wanted this or that..
surely having a list of categories is an essential part of any dj software ??
like I said, even PCDJ Red 5.2 etc had it...
why would anyone prefer to type in the name of the cat they want every time when all you need to do is just click on the cat you want ???
bonkers imo.
so no, I wont be "upgrading", and dont think im an ots hater because im not, I love 1.85
ps,,
I take your point about the set of questions being customisable
Because then that could be your list of categories,, ie instead of having questions like, what i have i played this gig etc
that could be the cats,,,
so then would only need one click to access your cat list
that wouldnt be so bad,, i could live with that :icon_lol:
pps>
it would be a lot better if on the first click of the down arrow, it went to the category list,,, and then have a option on that list to go to another list, ie the one with the options like what songs have i played this gig, if you see what i mean ?
that would make more sense and would keep the old style category freaks like me happy ....
Anyone else having issues with RAC from another machine, or is it just me? Screenshot below
No issues with the RAC sofar.
hi there
played with 1.9 all day and decided also thats its not for me. i am a full time dj working5+ nights a week, ive used ots for 8 years now and its just a few things that are wrong.
The search needs to search the whole library!! (ESSENTIAL)
I also use my left mouse button and cursor to highlight multiple tracks in a playlist to drag and move but with 1.9 it doesnt let you so you have to do them singular or use your shift key (MOre WOrk !!!)
And also with all that spare space around the mixer (This is when ive turned the turntables off) the loop buttons couldnt get any smaller!! these need to be bigger as i dont use a midi controller just a small keypad to operate the decks and mixer and apparently i cannot see any keyboard keys which operate the loop function so i have to use my mouse etc...bigger keys on screen needed!!!!
Surely a 2,4 8,16 bar keys for looping would have been better??
Quote from: JohnnyTheFox on August 02, 2012, 09:58:59 AM
Anyone else having issues with RAC from another machine, or is it just me? Screenshot below
it's okay - firewall issue now resolved :thumbsup:
Quote from: jeff wood on August 02, 2012, 08:29:44 AM
well Ive had a really good play with it now :rolleyes:
and whilst there's a lot of things I do really like about it,, BUT I just cannot live with having to type in the name of the category that I want.
it's funny, one of the down points of OTS (for me) was that there was only 6 categories on display,,,and I was hoping that on this release there would be more ! but, as it happens there now isn't any !
reading the comments on this thread is making me wonder; are any of you (including adam) actually DJ's ????
surely the MOST important feature of all is to be able to quickly click on whatever category (genre) you want ...
so to have to click on two places before you even get to your categories is a joke,
forget the other method,,,who's gonna want to type in the whole name of the category everytime they want to choose a category ???
and then,,,to make matters worse,,, when you want to do a global search (ie from your whole collection), , you have to exit whatever category you were in,,and then youve got the hassle of going back to it.
I'm quite a hands on DJ,, I'm always changing the category that I'm working off, and I even use the category list to help me decide genre of music I'm going to play.
So, after given it a lot of thought, I will be sticking with 1.85.
This release for me isn't gonna work.
What I just dont get ..
Is why on earth cant you just have a category list on the left,,ie why the output level display is,,,that is all thats needed !
Even my ancient PCDJ red 5.2 had a lovely category display on the left,,,,surely thats not too much to ask is it ???
So true, the features that Djs use seem to be being sidetracked Cats are essential and I agree more would have been better on tabs rather than hiding in menus. Also pretty annoyed the the cd read is now gone, I use this loads at fetes and weddings with dance groups etc.. ripping while out playing live..I don't think so. Why are the deck controls so small !! arrgghhh
Crashes within seconds of trying to do anything manually. No use whatsoever for community/public broadcasters - no voice track options (which some cheaper playout systems provide!), no decent scheduling that doesn't require laborious manual insertion of text lines in a template.
Overall, for a "here in November, no... it will be here later, no it will be here June/July but really on August 2", I am extremely disappointed and can't believe that I fell for the hype and delayed buying a playout system for many months for what seems to be just a basic upgrade, not a major change as hinted.
Quote from: Radioboy104 on August 02, 2012, 12:45:12 PM
Crashes within seconds of trying to do anything manually. No use whatsoever for community/public broadcasters - no voice track options (which some cheaper playout systems provide!), no decent scheduling that doesn't require laborious manual insertion of text lines in a template.
Overall, for a "here in November, no... it will be here later, no it will be here June/July but really on August 2", I am extremely disappointed and can't believe that I fell for the hype and delayed buying a playout system for many months for what seems to be just a basic upgrade, not a major change as hinted.
It seems you haven't read the posts from Adam & Steve about radio feature that will be with you shortly, but judging by your post you don't agree with it being a major change it really is, and things needed changing before some features can be implemented,
Remember you can't get to moon with out a rocket, someone has to first get the basics right then explore the moon or other planets.
I am sorry you are disappointed but I am sure the new features will be welcome when they come, and before you say it it shouldn't be that long hopefully.
Quote from: Jigger on August 02, 2012, 01:03:54 PM
It seems you haven't read the posts from Adam & Steve about radio feature that will be with you shortly, but judging by your post you don't agree with it being a major change it really is, and things needed changing before some features can be implemented,
Remember you can't get to moon with out a rocket, someone has to first get the basics right then explore the moon or other planets.
I am sorry you are disappointed but I am sure the new features will be welcome when they come, and before you say it it shouldn't be that long hopefully.
I did read it, but we all know how long it took for 1.90 to be released, plenty of time to implement all the planned features I would have thought. I think we've waited long enough for something more functional than 1.85 (for the record I did like 1.85 very much minus the lack of decent scheduling and no voice track option - which I see will still be an issue in 1.90).
If you can program, perhaps you should create something yourself to suit your needs. Let's see how long it takes you to get it done right. :)
If you can't program, then maybe, you should be a little more sympathetic towards Ots, and allow them to complete the software before you criticize them.
My point is that if you think it's so easy to do, do it yourself, or quit naggin'. If you were in their shoes, you'd look at things a whole lot differently than you do now.
Quote from: Artist formerly known as 'Jumpin' Jeff' on August 02, 2012, 01:27:36 PM
If you can program, perhaps you should create something yourself to suit your needs. Let's see how long it takes you to get it done right. :)
If you can't program, then maybe, you should be a little more sympathetic towards Ots, and allow them to complete the software before you criticize them.
My point is that if you think it's so easy to do, do it yourself, or quit naggin'. If you were in their shoes, you'd look at things a whole lot differently than you do now.
This is a great post.
I run a software development company here in the UK. Not directly in the same market as Ots but not a million miles away.
Fundamentally...bottom line...these guys run a business. And their primary goal - ignore any missions - is to make money. Mission statements matter...but with no money there's no business and then there is no mission either!
I'm far from privy to how Ots do their research...but I know how we do ours. And sometimes, well, most times when you release a product some people hate it, every time. Guaranteed. ACTUALLY they think they hate it...but all they really hate is change.
Unfortunately businesses have to make decisions that change products in order to continually target new markets and engage the business forward. It's hard: no business wants to alienate existing customers but fundamentally a healthy business needs to grow. Here's the killer...existing customers are existing customers because they liked the product up to now; new customers like the product because of where it is now and where it will go. A business has to be smart: smart with technology, smart with products and smart with money.
Now, I bought Ots years ago and I think I paid less then £50! That's ridiculous. We retail our software at work at £199 at the cheapest and right up to £5000 at the top. If I had spent £5k on an app and that app suddenly changed without notice then I would be apprehensive. But in this case, I paid £50 max for Ots, I use version 1.85 and it does EXACTLY what I need it to do. I've very little right to say that this new version is crap and demand that the guys abandon their work and go back to a 1.85 feel. For £50? From 10 years ago? No, not a chance. I'm using a great tool, irregardless of version and it does just the job I need.
I know some people are angry over the release...and dealing with customers at work directly I know how you feel. But at the same time I love what I have so far in this application: if I didn't then I would be looking elsewhere for apps (or writing my own LOL!). I would seriously recommend from personal experience that anyone hating it give it a chance for a month or so...and see how you feel. Remember: nobody knows where the software will go...but to go ANYWHERE near where you want it to go it needs to have a strong business behind it. And that's the key.
I'm off for a play with the new one!
G
Love the way you can drag and drop onto the video monitors :)
Well said G. I am to a happy user and glad for all new things coming up thogh it is a pain sometimes to learn all the gimmics. :thumbsup:
Quote from: Gar Lark See on August 02, 2012, 04:39:30 PM
This is a great post.
I run a software development company here in the UK. Not directly in the same market as Ots but not a million miles away.
Fundamentally...bottom line...these guys run a business. And their primary goal - ignore any missions - is to make money. Mission statements matter...but with no money there's no business and then there is no mission either!
I'm far from privy to how Ots do their research...but I know how we do ours. And sometimes, well, most times when you release a product some people hate it, every time. Guaranteed. ACTUALLY they think they hate it...but all they really hate is change.
Unfortunately businesses have to make decisions that change products in order to continually target new markets and engage the business forward. It's hard: no business wants to alienate existing customers but fundamentally a healthy business needs to grow. Here's the killer...existing customers are existing customers because they liked the product up to now; new customers like the product because of where it is now and where it will go. A business has to be smart: smart with technology, smart with products and smart with money.
Now, I bought Ots years ago and I think I paid less then £50! That's ridiculous. We retail our software at work at £199 at the cheapest and right up to £5000 at the top. If I had spent £5k on an app and that app suddenly changed without notice then I would be apprehensive. But in this case, I paid £50 max for Ots, I use version 1.85 and it does EXACTLY what I need it to do. I've very little right to say that this new version is crap and demand that the guys abandon their work and go back to a 1.85 feel. For £50? From 10 years ago? No, not a chance. I'm using a great tool, irregardless of version and it does just the job I need.
I know some people are angry over the release...and dealing with customers at work directly I know how you feel. But at the same time I love what I have so far in this application: if I didn't then I would be looking elsewhere for apps (or writing my own LOL!). I would seriously recommend from personal experience that anyone hating it give it a chance for a month or so...and see how you feel. Remember: nobody knows where the software will go...but to go ANYWHERE near where you want it to go it needs to have a strong business behind it. And that's the key.
I'm off for a play with the new one!
G
Well Put
Well, I have not downloaded Esperance yet, I am afraid to after all the negative reviews!
I really like it. Keyboard shortcuts, Karaoke Key Change & Looping are just a few features I really like. Give it a few days yourself and decide if you like it!!
Quote from: Ed on August 02, 2012, 05:59:56 PM
Well, I have not downloaded Esperance yet, I am afraid to after all the negative reviews!
I recommend trying it for yourself - most of the negative aspects of the reviews are personal preferences (something that Ots Labs can never predict) and some of them (mine included) are initial reactions. I think it's a 'grower' - the more you use it, the more you will like it. It does require a certain amount of effort on your part though to use it in the manner that Ots Labs have envisioned.
well im at a gig now,,,
ive my normal system running 1.85, and my lappy thats got the trial exp on it...
and now im 100% decided im sticking with the old version.
the categories,,the perfectly placed drop down cat menu is better
plus the media libary search box is better,,i can open that,, scroll through search results,, leave it on screen if i want,,,, go back to the cat im on,,
all sorts.
sorry guys, but 1.85 is much better.
also text is easier to read on 1.85 being white on black instead of grey on black
i do prefer the look of esp tho,,it does look chic, and more modern,,,
ok
i downloaded trial version last night to see how it was before upgrading and played with it for about an hour on my desktop pc truth is i wasnt that impressed.
go forward to this morning dowloaded trial onto my laptop and played about with it for about 4 hours using my hercules rmx controller and suddenly its turned out spiffing, to be honnest was a little dissapointed that ohml map hadnt ben updated to use new looping facility so posted on here asking if anybody had any plans on updating ohml file and then up pops OTS steve with this reply
Hi Rosie,
This controller will be updated to work with the looping in Esperance (along with some other controllers) in the next several days. When it is ready it will be uploaded for download on this page:
http://www.otsav.com/midi-hardware-control-maps/
Ots_Steve
so looks like ots is upgrading controller maps over the next week
I have recently been using traktor as main software as wanted looping and better control of software with external controller but missed the reliabilty and confidence of OTS
So i am a very happy camper up to now with esperance
Brian (RosieR1)
Well it seems people are dividing into two camps. Someone on here said Marmite, and it seems to be that you either love it or hate it; well not quite.
I was I have to say a little disappointed with it last night but really felt for Ots_Adam (and the other Ots's) who had been working their b*llocks off to produce something that they are really proud of only to be abused and kicked for it by some people. Just think on guys, you do what you think is a really great gig; you have most up on the dance floor only to be told at the end of the night by the person who booked you that ou were really c*ap. You took too long to set up, they didn't like the look of you and whilst you were stable, there were better DJs around cheaper with more features. And for this you had really prepared hard and not slept for days. You'd feel a bit pi**ed off, right?
I'm not saying we should love everything that Ots does unequivocally without question, no if we have a critiscism we should do it positively. Would it be better if this feature did so and so, rather than this feature is sh*t! The words respect, politeness and tact are all words in common usage in English. Let's try and use some of them, eh?
Anyway the bottom line is that having used Esperpance today, I'm loving it! Just as Ots_Adam said would happen. Yes, it's different and that's what we have to get used to. The look is cool, and yes I miss a few features but the other benefits outweigh the lost ones. The search is much more powerful and having tried out Darryl's suggestions on how you can manipulate the order in which the library is set out is a real wow for me too. It has also been rock solid on audio and video for the last 12 hours, as we all knew it would be.
Give it time, give it a chance and in the meantime don't p*ss off the developer! You never know you might be eating your words in a few days time!
Well done to Ots_Adam, Ots_Steve and the other members of the Ots family. You have worked really hard and I for one am proud to own a product that in this day and age does not get realeased until the manufacturer is entirely happy with it, no matter how many people nag and moan about it. It is all too rare a quality in these cheap and throwaway times. Yes, It WAS worth the wait!
Johnnythefox...I applaud you..no I give you a standing ovation.....Very nice post....This is what I've been feeling over the last couple of days, but I could not have put it more eloquently as you. I also say it's worth it. Unfortunately as we grow older and set in our ways, younger ones come in and want differently looks and features. This has also gone the same direction in my other business of tool sales. I see something in a certain color or design and I say Yuck....then I get a young technician on my truck and he yells out Awesome I love it.......In order for a companty to grow and keep the new up and comings happy unfortunately some of us older ones may have to say yuck once in a while. But you know what?? That yuck many times turns back into that "Awesome I love it".....
while im not sure ill upgrade yet (still playing with the trial etc and waiting for downtime to possibly update machines) i am keeping this in mind. When the Iphone first came out i was really hesitant. not having any real buttons but 1? what if something went wrong etc etc. now on my 2nd phone 3g then 4S and probably wont go anywhere else. apple had a vision and everyone had to get use to it....and then loved it. I plan on having the trial fired up at a gig on a second laptop(not hooked in to the sound system) to see how it feels in its actual setting (im concerned with some of the buttons as i use a mouse primarily not keyboard shortcuts.)....time will tell.
Bravo JohnnyTheFox. Great comparison to our jobs as DJs, it really sucks when even one person at an event gives a scathing remark on our performance. Respect and politeness are attributes we should encourage. Thank you.
Thanks crpman67 and Dr J.
Just doing what i see as ma job! :happy:
Esperance was released 5 mins after I walked out of the door!
So, I did a 7hr gig with my trusty OADJPC+ v1.85/HC4500/X900 (whilst popping in and out of the forum/facebook to see the comments).
After a good 5hr sleep, I downloaded/installed v1.9 in seconds, no licensing issues (as usual), launched my own .oml and it was straight in there, I didn't even have to refresh the library ... bosh!
I've held off any comments until now.
I love the look/feel, the library/OMQL/search is amazing (expandable/collapsible without losing items in karaoke/history/prepare), looping is a welcome feature, the keyboard shortcuts are easy, no issues with turntables, clock, text size or colours. The on-deck controls could be a tad bigger, but I'm using a controller so it doesn't actually affect me.
I've been testing/playing for the past 12hrs, I use majority video, I've had them running backwards independently/simultaneously, looping both forward & backward whilst scratching, phasing & drinking tea ... and not a blip! Rock Solid ... as I expected.
As an OtsAV Reseller & Solutions Provider, managing 60+ instances at any one time, we will be advising current clients to switch/upgrade to v1.9
As a DJ I will be using it tomorrow night at a regular gig, I will not have a back-up.
Well done Team Ots :thumbsup:, I can't wait to see what's coming next (pun intended!)
You know something? I think Ots may have been working on selection too. In the past we have commented that often Ots will seem to have a favourite artist randomly selected when generating a playlist from an event table template. I have often noticed it and will sometimes remark that for example Ots likes U2 today!
Not so today however! In the 13 hours it has been running here I have not noticed any overly often selected artists which would lead me to make that comment.
It might be my imagination, but I do wonder whether there have been improvements to playlist generation?
hope none of my comments were seen as being rude,, certainly didnt mean to be
obviously got total respect for the ots boys,, as i use 1.85 all the time and love it
really the fact that im not changing just shows how good 1.85 actually is.....
Quote from: JohnnyTheFox on August 02, 2012, 08:27:56 PM
Well it seems people are dividing into two camps. Someone on here said Marmite, and it seems to be that you either love it or hate it; well not quite.
I was I have to say a little disappointed with it last night but really felt for Ots_Adam (and the other Ots's) who had been working their b*llocks off to produce something that they are really proud of only to be abused and kicked for it by some people. Just think on guys, you do what you think is a really great gig; you have most up on the dance floor only to be told at the end of the night by the person who booked you that ou were really c*ap. You took too long to set up, they didn't like the look of you and whilst you were stable, there were better DJs around cheaper with more features. And for this you had really prepared hard and not slept for days. You'd feel a bit pi**ed off, right?
I'm not saying we should love everything that Ots does unequivocally without question, no if we have a critiscism we should do it positively. Would it be better if this feature did so and so, rather than this feature is sh*t! The words respect, politeness and tact are all words in common usage in English. Let's try and use some of them, eh?
Anyway the bottom line is that having used Esperpance today, I'm loving it! Just as Ots_Adam said would happen. Yes, it's different and that's what we have to get used to. The look is cool, and yes I miss a few features but the other benefits outweigh the lost ones. The search is much more powerful and having tried out Darryl's suggestions on how you can manipulate the order in which the library is set out is a real wow for me too. It has also been rock solid on audio and video for the last 12 hours, as we all knew it would be.
Give it time, give it a chance and in the meantime don't p*ss off the developer! You never know you might be eating your words in a few days time!
Well done to Ots_Adam, Ots_Steve and the other members of the Ots family. You have worked really hard and I for one am proud to own a product that in this day and age does not get realeased until the manufacturer is entirely happy with it, no matter how many people nag and moan about it. It is all too rare a quality in these cheap and throwaway times. Yes, It WAS worth the wait!
Thanks for backing me up Johnny!
Well said!
Quote from: Dr.J on August 02, 2012, 08:58:12 PM
Bravo JohnnyTheFox. Great comparison to our jobs as DJs, it really sucks when even one person at an event gives a scathing remark on our performance. Respect and politeness are attributes we should encourage. Thank you.
I totally agree Dr. Respect and politeness will get you much further in life than being rude and disrespectful to others.
Quote from: jeff wood on August 02, 2012, 09:35:02 PM
hope none of my comments were seen as being rude,, certainly didnt mean to be
obviously got total respect for the ots boys,, as i use 1.85 all the time and love it
really the fact that im not changing just shows how good 1.85 actually is.....
Jeff, You comments are mild compared to some I've seen on FB.
I think that the core members on this forum remember the efforts of Jeff (and other moderators, but mostly Jeff) have made over the years to discourage members from launching into personal attacks on people and generally treat each other with respect - something that seems to be rife in the more popular social media outlets where moderation is perhaps less strict.
It is probably the only reason why this forum has survived where others didn't.
I love this Forum and everyone's comments. :thumbsup: ....... much better comments here than on face-book.
I'm still a 50/50 man with this new update (still having some pops & crackles when using the mouse on the scroll lists) but it's someone different to look at now with a new sexy screen.
Well I used both tonight. I see that OTS is a business and has to make money and I also think they will take everything into consideration that we post here, our likes and dislikes about the new software. After all, feedback from the the customers is how most businesses become successful.
Here's my 2 cents so far:
The search is a very nice touch, just to start typing in a specific item and get the results, although you can't select the text you've typed and just start another search, you have to right click and select delete or backspace through it.
I use the media library to search for ranges of songs, I might be looking for a song in the 128 BPM range or a song by Katy Perry to play and I liked that I was able to click on a column and sort the library that way by BPM. Clicking on the Artist, Title, Time, BPM etc headers was easy. Now I have to do extra clicks to achieve the same results. Put the column headers back. I have all my videos and music categorized and it was easy to click on a category at the top of the Media library and have it displayed, I wanted the old version to let us change the top categories to whatever we wanted, The all items, albums, categorized and CD Audio. I didn't mind the Uncategorized tab, I used it often. There is no uncategorized option now as far as I can see.
I like the ability to have extra panes open, I don't have much use for the Karaoke tab and will turn it off after I figure out how. I always wanted to have extra tabs/panes to display different categories. like the ability to have my playlist and 3 media libraries open at the same time so i could display my dance, rock and Latin categories all together and being able to change the column width is something that I believe should be put back.
The new graphics are nice, but as most of you have mentioned, the background, the 3 black colors need some improvement, I particularly liked the LCD color scheme of the old one. Text is hard to read and I turned off the lines that jump around in the background, I already have to deal with smoke filled rooms and dangerous decibel levels all night. I don't want my computer flashing at me, If it was a VU level meter or something to that effect it would be better for me. maybe they could move the dynamics processor levels back there and provide a option to change it. I'm glad they provided a option to turn it off. The younger DJ's I'm sure will love it. I liked the background style of "Colour" on the last version.
Everything looks smaller too. the Icons, text, video monitors. I particularly liked the "AIR" monitor bigger, but the controls on the decks are very small, a slight shake of the mouse and your hitting the next button. I like the layout of the decks, I wish when i turned off the turntables the decks would get a little larger, It seems like so much wasted space. I don't scratch so the turntables there just not for me, why not let us display toggle between the turntables and the album cover like the old version, and or make the decks bigger. I use a Denon Media controller for most of my gigs but there are a few gigs where I'll just click away.
The looping function is great, Ots did a good job here, i needed it and it is fantastic. In future releases i would like to see a flanger, echo and some effects.
I miss the CD audio, say there is a contest going on and someone brings me a CD of their music, Happened tonight, I don't have time to talk on the mic, line up songs and then convert a CD to a Otsfile on another computer put it on a thumb drive and scan it into my "AIR" computer. Please put this back.
I'm disappointed that Ots Studio was not upgraded to support MP4, I know they are working on it. but I feel this should have been a top priority along with support for other formats. You should be able to support all the formats that VLC supports. and also I was hoping that the DMX support would be included in this release. I hope they are still working on this.
I have other things but I think I'll wait for the documentation to come out before I comment. I wanna make sure I'm doing it right as there are no help files as of yet.
I think the lack of documentation is holding me back a little, Maybe most of the things I mentioned above can be done. I'm very interested in reading it.
I'm just one person out of many who is basically beta testing this now, all my comments are meant for positive input and in no way are trashing anyone. I have always been impressed with OTS and think it is a far superior product to others out there, I read some where here that Ots needed to step into the new look. but i feel that the look became more of a priority than the function. Looping was a priority and you did a great job on that.
My wishlist for future development is getting Studio to convert MP4, as every service I subscribe to only furnishes MP4.
Get the DMX thing working.
Add some effects.
Thank you OTS for you hard work and I'm sure that all of our (your customers who tell other DJ's that this is the best software out there) input will make this even better.
Zak
why are people so bothered about mp4,,,, its not the end of the world just to convert mp4's to mpeg2 and then to .ots
doesnt take long.
Very nice review zakdj.
I think Ots need to add to their new 1.91 release more user options to change the user interface colors and font(s) sizes. Also a option to turn of the audio processing graphics.
I'm an old school dj, and my eyes do not getting better over the years.
The young djs like flashing stuff all over the place, i do like more stuff that matters.
Users need to have the abilty to change the gui a little bit to their needs.
The same thing goes for broadcast users i think.
I wait for the next upgrade from Ots, before i start using 1.9x for my gigs.
I will be missing the looping function and the better search capabilty, so be it.....
Zakdj, thanks for your informative post how Esp performed on the night. I have a gig on Saturday which I have only just got (don't you just love last minute bookings) and was hoping to have a week to play around with Esp but your and other guys write ups have giving me faith for the gig. Got a feeling I'm going to be on my toes all night trying to remember where everything is laid out lol.
Got to agree with you on one point is the absence of CD import. You and a few other guys have mentioned this fact and I think this is a backward step. OTS Adam calls it old school tech but it was a tech that is still very useful in today's high tech enviroment. Please Adam/Steve could we please have this back. I can see problems when someone brings you a Cd to play and you inform them sorry but my software does not allow me to play Cd's. Is OTS the only software that does this?
Mr Jeff Wood, remember you from years ago on mfdj forums how are you? I can understand your problems with the search/cat part of the software and to tell you the truth I had these same thoughts but after reading a few threads on here about how to set up the media library to the way I want it I feel alot more confident using it. Yes I can see a few problems happening before I master it but that is progress. Not to sound rude but I think you need to spend some time with this because I can't see OTS changing or going back to how it was done in 1.85, mind you adding a drop down button to show cats can't be that hard, which will leave you with two options either embrace it or get left behind. Once again buddy please don't take the last sentence the wrong way it is just the way I see it.
Quote from: Zakdj on August 03, 2012, 08:57:41 AM
The search is a very nice touch, just to start typing in a specific item and get the results, although you can't select the text you've typed and just start another search, you have to right click and select delete or backspace through it.
Press <Ctrl>+<Backspace> to clear the contents of the search/OMQL fields.
Quote from: Darryl on August 03, 2012, 11:33:43 AM
Press <Ctrl>+<Backspace> to clear the contents of the search/OMQL fields.
Although that works, so does plain old pressing the delete key by itself.
Cool - thanks Jeff - I didn't know that the <Del> key cleared the content.
Ok just got around to installing Esperance as i've been away in Spain for the past 3 and a bit days.
Now...upon launch I was sent various screenshots and my immediate reactions were...EURGH
But...on reflection, having now installed it, and played with it...I quite like it. The interface, if a little umm gimmicky (is that a word?) does work quite well.
I like the turntables, I like how they work. I'd like to be able to put my own graphic on them though :thumbsup:
I like the multiple lists across the bottom.
I like the looping.
So...even though i'm not an active user of this package anymore, I really like the update so well done guys!
I think once there's some better support in there for controllers and a few more tweaks here and there i'd probably consider ditching my mac and Traktor to come back to this. Yes I really did just say that, but it does need a few more refinements though.
Certainly when the controller support comes in, some of the smaller buttons on the interface would cease to be a problem. Being able to quickly pick up a 4-beat loop and double/half it on an MC6000/MC3000 would be superb, as would the ability to use multiple cues.
So yep, well done guys, big thumbs pointing up from me to you.
You know what it's like...how many times do people moan at Facebook for their upgrades...and then a month later everyone loves them.
Quote from: mel garland on August 03, 2012, 09:42:20 AM
Mr Jeff Wood, remember you from years ago on mfdj forums how are you? I can understand your problems with the search/cat part of the software and to tell you the truth I had these same thoughts but after reading a few threads on here about how to set up the media library to the way I want it I feel alot more confident using it. Yes I can see a few problems happening before I master it but that is progress. Not to sound rude but I think you need to spend some time with this because I can't see OTS changing or going back to how it was done in 1.85, mind you adding a drop down button to show cats can't be that hard, which will leave you with two options either embrace it or get left behind. Once again buddy please don't take the last sentence the wrong way it is just the way I see it.
Hi Mel,,hows it going ?
And mate, I'm not having any problems,, I just dont like it :icon_lol:
The previous search and category way is much better to use.
I can understand the system being ok for some dj's, but for someone who moves fast the old way is better.
ALso,,,whats bugging me,,,,,
People talk about the new search system, and OTS saying how powerful it is etc etc etc
But lets be honest,,,unless you're a complete dumb ******,,,,you shouldnt have any problem finding what you want with the old system...
I mean, its laughable sometimes..
I see people say, oh you can type in beatles and love ..
Well.,,,if i want a beatles song with love in the title, i'll just type beatles in the search box and scroll down to the one I want..
why the OTS guys felt the need to spend their valuable time working on the search method is beyond me when theres so many other things they could have been working on..
I could go further and say that the ONLY thing the old search system needed was more category boxes....
I hear you Jeff...but I too wanted more category box shortcuts many years ago until I really got into the OMQL.
An integrated search box and media library is very very powerful indeed.
I did have to alter my category names however from 90's to 90s (i.e. losing the apostrophe) but being able to just search
90s & dance & bpm=130
Is incredibly powerful...and very very quick too.
Searching for "beatles & love" is infintely quicker than clicking on search, typing in beatles and then browsing to the file you want. How can you not see this?
Adapt mate...you'll thank us for it. I know you can be an old stick in the mud sometimes :icon_lol:
It's not going to change back so adopt the changes now so you can enjoy the groovy new features in the future.
Ian,,Im no stick in the mud,,
but I do speak my mind as you know :)
so you're saying youre happy to actually type in the name of the cat you want, instead of just clicking on it ??
I know you can alter the names of the cats,,but you've still got to type them in..
how on earth is that better or quicker ???
If you want 90s, you need to type that and hot enter
I just click on 90s :)
Same with your other example..
you actually gonna type in 90s and dance & bpm = 130 ???
damn you must like typing :)
I'll just click on 90's dance and scroll to want I want.....
and same with the beatles example....
how the funk is it quicker to actually type beatles and love
rather than just type beatl and then scroll to the one you want...
Fair play,,I spose if poeple like typing then fair enough
personally the only time during a gig I use the keyboard is for when I need a specific song..
no way in the world im gonna be typing out the name of the cat I want to browse everytime..
honestly think about it, the old system was much better :thumbsup:
I disagree full stop.
OMQL is so very powerful, embrace it Jeff :laugh:
I haven't used it at a gig yet, but I can see the search is so much better. If you click on beatles, you still have to scroll to find all the songs with love in them. If you type in beatles & love...now only the beatlers songs with love in the title will show up. Less time scrolling and searching...you just get the 5-10 beatles songs with love in them...I think it's quicker...I was just playing with that...or...what if someone wanted a madonna song from the 80's.....now just type in madonna and 80....poof they are there....quick and simple.... Just my two cents though
Jeff, You say the the additional click to get to cats is unbearable, yet, to do a search on the old system ( previous to 1.90) you had to click the search box, then click in the edit box before typing. Now, IMO, this was done many times more than selecting a category in the media library, and slowed me 10 fold to enter text in the search box. The new search combines the media library window and the search box making it much more usable to filter/refine the search, making it also that much more usefull IMO. I much prefer typing the OMQL info into 1.90 over previous versions as when you had a bad query, you had an error dialog.... No more. You still get a notice, but just above the OMQL search in a status bar as "? Invalid OMQL". Much less irritating, and cleaner all around.
Usually, when I do an OMQL query, it's for more than a single genre/category anyhow.
I still think you should give it bit more exercise to get more acquainted with it personally.
It'll click for you eventually.
As for the look, hey, that will change too, hopefully soon to squash all the complaints for the visual impaired. Even I have trouble with the small text at times.
Does anyone know if the radio version of Esperance looks the same as OtsAV DJ Pro Esperance?
Should think so as I now discovered that ID time are Orange in Playlist which I find nice. On the Buy page they have uppdated the Webbcaster to 1,90 but not the Radio version
For all those people who miss the ability to play a cd in esperance,,,,,,,, see if this works for you . it works for me on a humble single core 3ghz with 2 gb ram.
install Ots Turntables FREE and play the cd through TT concurrently whilst Esperance finishes off the cued track,
Ok you cant do anything like mix it in or anything but then IT WORKS who needs cdda in esperance now? I Don't.
Well Done OTS the solutions to most problems are already there LOL
How do you switch between the decks and turntables? When I try to select turntables from the View>Turntables menu it says; "show (if possible)" but nothing happens to the display.
Maybe my license is not a full license? I have the OTSAV DJ Pro Classic +
Any thoughts?
How do you mean ...if the resolution on the monitor is right (widescreen) you see them both...turntables are visual effect
I had the exact same problem... you have to turn your resolution up which means the decks will get even smaller, but then it gives more room for the turntables to show up. Not a huge deal unless you use them for scratching.....I'll probably turn my resolution back down to make the decks a little bigger. I don't do a whole lot of scratching anyway.
Thanks dickus51 and cprman67.. I got it to work.
Wow, I can barely see the text with the resolution cranked up on my new Vaio widescreen laptop. I'll stick with the lower resolution as I don't really need to use the turntables.
I set up my gig rig last night in the garage and ran Esperance in a low light setting and (like most have mentioned) struggled with the display. At my gigs my eyes are constantly bouncing between the dance floor and my equipment and I hope it's not an impediment. The dynamics processor display is considerably brighter (and bouncy) compared to the rest of the display which will take some getting used to in low light situations.
Have a good weekend...
Quote from: Artist formerly known as 'Jumpin' Jeff' on August 03, 2012, 04:03:32 PM
Jeff, You say the the additional click to get to cats is unbearable, yet, to do a search on the old system ( previous to 1.90) you had to click the search box, then click in the edit box before typing. Now, IMO, this was done many times more than selecting a category in the media library, and slowed me 10 fold to enter text in the search box. The new search combines the media library window and the search box making it much more usable to filter/refine the search, making it also that much more usefull IMO. I much prefer typing the OMQL info into 1.90 over previous versions as when you had a bad query, you had an error dialog.... No more. You still get a notice, but just above the OMQL search in a status bar as "? Invalid OMQL". Much less irritating, and cleaner all around.
Usually, when I do an OMQL query, it's for more than a single genre/category anyhow.
I still think you should give it bit more exercise to get more acquainted with it personally.
It'll click for you eventually.
As for the look, hey, that will change too, hopefully soon to squash all the complaints for the visual impaired. Even I have trouble with the small text at times.
Hi Jeff.
not sure what you mean additional click to get to cats,,,
at the moment, with 1.85 I have 5 cats i can directly click on,,,and then one click to get the drop down list of cats...
with exp I have to click in two places to get to the cats....
and with 1.85 I can have the search box open,,search for stuff aswell as having the cat open that im working with .
with exp, i cant do that, its one or the other.
I honestly never used the cat buttons.
What I am saying is sure it takes an additional click to get to the cats in that god aweful long list that will be growing to 255 soon enough, making it even more difficult, and slow to filter through. IMO, no big loss.
I open and closed the search panel most all the time because I have enough stuff on my desktop with lighting control and such, so it was always open, then click the edit box before I began typing, and then have to select all before trying a new search. 1.90 makes this a simple start typing, and to start again, press del and do so.
I've always dreamed about the combining of the search and ML panels because you can't search through your genres in the search panel , and you can't search as you type in the media library. Now you can do both. And better, because you couldn't do a search on artist and title in the same search as you can now.
The find capability is still there, and honestly, another feature I very rarely use. It's all you had previously in the ML however.
All in all I find this new search to be much more efficient.
I know I don't have direct access through AHK to the OMQL query box, but you could still set up an ahk GUI that you could select genres from, and copy the strings to the clipboard, then you could click on the query box & paste... Just an alternate thought. As you probably remember, I like work arounds for my inconveniences.
Quote from: dickus51 on August 03, 2012, 05:07:45 PM
Should think so as I now discovered that ID time are Orange in Playlist which I find nice. On the Buy page they have uppdated the Webbcaster to 1,90 but not the Radio version
It might be that anything that's been played recently (maybe within last 24 hours) is shown as orange in playlist (which is most likely to include IDs). A useful feature. I need to have a play with that.
Haa that's it 24 hour it is . Wondered why not all ID.s showed :wowza: :blusha:
I think it's anything played within the last 12 hours. This is based on the option to show only items from the current gig in the drop-down OMQL list gives items played in the last 12 hours.
http://www.otsav.com/esperance/
"Any item played within the last 12 hours is displayed in an alternate colour (even in other lists), making it really easy to visually notice items you have already played at a gig before perhaps selecting them again by mistake."
@Jeff
also,,I like having the media libary box on 1.85,,,the fact that when you search for a song, you get a list,,,,that to me often gives me inspiration, ie other songs that might have similar words in,, i think oh thats a good idea , I'll play that later etc etc etc
I kind of work mostly categories but also the search box is open a lot...so Ive got two avenues open at the same time for finding songs...
Works well for me:)
ps,,dont quite get your point about clicking edit select all etc ???
I just open the search box and type what i want,,,couldnt be easier...
For me the lack of the Cats are a huge thing. I do mostly weddings. And to have my wedding flow basically how I set up the Cats. With each portion getting it's own. Including clients choices of must plays and play if you can. I have loved having my ceremony music and other special things in its own category.
Quote from: JohnnyTheFox on August 02, 2012, 09:34:16 PM
In the past we have commented that often Ots will seem to have a favourite artist randomly selected when generating a playlist from an event table template. I have often noticed it and will sometimes remark that for example Ots likes U2 today!
Check your ratings number for the overly played track. Higher ratings plays the track more often.
Quote from: nextgen1 on August 04, 2012, 03:28:22 PM
For me the lack of the Cats are a huge thing. I do mostly weddings. And to have my wedding flow basically how I set up the Cats. With each portion getting it's own. Including clients choices of must plays and play if you can. I have loved having my ceremony music and other special things in its own category.
What do you mean lack of cats? They may not be what some consider as easy to get to, but they are still there, and from what the intro for esperance commented on, the cats will soon grow to 255 from 127. That's good news.
I just mean that they were easy to get to and easy for me to use thats all.
I too don't understand the issue with categories. I just tried playing with Esperance again to make sure I didn't miss anything, as I use categories all the time. No double-click necessary, just a single-click on the down-arrow > move down one spot and wait for the pop-up menu to show > scroll the list just the same as 1.85. If I'm missing something please let me know, maybe I'm just missing the obvious.
Having been playing with 1.90 since its release I am to like it more and more.
The only issue I see that could affect it long term is the non ability to resize the playlist area, in terms of what it is used for; simply cueing songs to play it takes up a lot of real estate on the screen.
What I personally would prefer is a smaller playlist area and NO Dynamics processor instead have a side bar with categories, a resizable library and prep window and the ability to either have or not to have the Karaoke option.
Another feature that VDJ has that is useful is a menu allowing you not to see video and karaoke files with just one click, you guys need to remember we are not all computer programmers we are the end user.
Above all good software in the main however a few tweaks are needed quickly rather than later.
I think to bring OTS into the new centaury it needs to have options for skins as many controllers use different parts of the software.
If I do say so myself I believe you need to release another update within two months.
Quote from: Dr.J on August 06, 2012, 07:10:41 AM
I too don't understand the issue with categories. I just tried playing with Esperance again to make sure I didn't miss anything, as I use categories all the time. No double-click necessary, just a single-click on the down-arrow > move down one spot and wait for the pop-up menu to show > scroll the list just the same as 1.85. If I'm missing something please let me know, maybe I'm just missing the obvious.
Hi Dr J,
The issue with cats on esp isnt the end of the world,, as yes they are still there.
I've just been saying that I prefer the cat system on 1.85 because firstly you have 5 cats that you can directly click on,, and for the other cats, its just one button to click and then you get the drop down cats.
And are all in the same area, so not much mouse movement is needed, all works great.
With esp, you dont have any cats that you can directly click on, and to get to the list of cats, you have to click on on the arrow, and then choose select all files or whatever it says,, so you have to do more to access the cats.
To me, this is adding to the workload :)
Not the end of the world as I said, but a PITA all the same,,,,
Add to that, the loss of the separate media libary search box, which I think is fantastic, are the reasons why I'm sticking with 1.85.
Doc, nope it was me I was missing the obvious. :thumbsup:
Jeff, the old setup is what I liked about it as well.
Hello there
I installed the Trial version and have it run now for a couple of hours. No glitch so far. Great.
From the first glance, I somehow like and dislike the new visual approach choosen by OTS. I like the more cleaned up and structured screen. After I could turn off this 'tube' kind of animation, it feels much relaxed (I do not need a light show on the music pc, therefore I do have my light fixtures doing a much better job :thumbsup:).
The color scheme do require additional color combination as mentioned by lots of users here. Working in a fully lighted room, this all black approach makes the users eyes tired very fast. (@OTS-crew, please have look at some studies about color combinations, that are business approved, that means work ergonomically). Used in a FOH in a theatre this black might be the choice for me to not disturb too many audiences around you, but sure not in a studio or outdoor job.
As said, it looks cleaned up. I like the programm window size to be adjusted to whatever size of desire. I would even go one step further and make a dockable approach with the various tabs like history, media library, karaoke, prepare... make them detachable to an own window and have them e.g. on a second screen. That would then free up place for the the other tabs the user wants to leave within the main window. Column size adjustment is a MUST !!
Is OTS aiming a cooperation with DENON? Or is it pure coincidence that the decks model are in the same naming convention like DENON controllers (HC7400). I like DENON products and considering myself to buy some HC4500 or MC6000 for the production cases.
One thing I complained long time ago are the handling of Placeholders in playlists. Every once in a while files do change and a refresh might cause the software to no longer find a particular title. OTS guys haven't made yet a right click menu item to display what artist/title stands behind a placeholder. That would be very helpful to correct the playlists. The playlist files at least do have that information stored as plain ACSII text, so retreival of that piece of information should be easy. We do have hundreds of playlists for almost every occasion and having e.g. 3 out of 5 files missing in the list makes not fun.
Another long time wish is to have a better prelistening possibility. Yes, an additional simple player. I do not mean the third and fourth deck required anyway. The player I mention should be customizable to a particular audio channel like the air and cue channels today are. I know you can double click on an item to bring up the album window, then select 'Play in OTS player'. Using that method ends up in two windows which need manual closure. If you are in a rush this slows you down. Move the item into the unused deck and send it to cue is another solution, but then the song goes into the history list. We usually save the history to be used for future reference or for paying the copyright fees. So we don't want to have unplayed prelisten songs there.
My suggestion would be to click the little OTS logo icon in front of each item to open that particular player intended for PFL. All it needs is a timeline to skip forward/backwards in music and a close button. That's it. Above method can be used if you want to browse thorugh multiple songs in an album. But then OTSPlayer should be customizable to choose which audio channel to be used and not only go to the default windows system sounds channel.
Another wish is to have the Inser Directives enhanced when it comes to placeholders. Now with the colored appearance of the placeholders, it would be helpful to have a editable place holder. Maybe better called a customizable text tag. That would help to separate songs visually and name blocks like 'Start_R'n'R_1' and 'Stop_R'n'R_1' or any other one liner note useful for the production.
To finish one feature I just discovered. In history it shows the time the song was last played. That is neat, but when searching the library, this time is also shown and this is VERY helpful, especially when there is more than one DJ working the evening. Just great, thanks OTS guys.
That's it for the moment. Let it rock.
Martin
For the future I like to see a search option for an specific year in the library!
It's still not possible now.
Would be really helpful if we can do a search for example 1984 instead of 1980s and see only the songs from 1984 and not all the songs of the 80s.
This way I hope to use the specific year selection in the advanced playlist generation too.
Sweet, In the next update, it seems they want to increase the cats/genres from 128 to 255, so with this addition we can affort a few more assigned to year.
I waited years for this !!!! :no: :no:
I won't be upgrading anytime soon.
Cats... I mourn your loss. I know I know.... they are still there. But as mentioned earlier, I would make new cats for each wedding I did. When it was time to play the cake cutting song, I one clicked one tab and all the specialty songs I needed for that wedding were right there. When it was time to play music again, I one clicked one tab and all the sings I had pre-selected for that wedding dance were right there. It is faster than the system they have in 1.90 and when you have to quickly switch from one cat to another you can't beat 1.85.
It took me a while, but I've finally found a way to script the OMQL field - so when one of us gets a chance to write an AHK file, you can have whatever buttons you like (categories or more advanced queries like only karaoke, only video, anything other than karaoke and so on).
Quote from: Darryl on August 07, 2012, 06:48:39 AM
It took me a while, but I've finally found a way to script the OMQL field - so when one of us gets a chance to write an AHK file, you can have whatever buttons you like (categories or more advanced queries like only karaoke, only video, anything other than karaoke and so on).
You can simply use Shift+Left.
From the keyboard shortcuts guide:
Quote
SHIFT+LEFT/RIGHT: change which ML field is active (and activate ML) - LEFT = OMQL, RIGHT = Search
Thanks Adam. I was looking at it the 'old' way before - thinking that since these weren't windows I couldn't focus on them. Of course this means that I can (and help out people missing the category buttons too).
That was simple enough! Thanks Adam!
Quote from: Galager on August 07, 2012, 06:01:37 AM
Cats... I mourn your loss. I know I know.... they are still there. But as mentioned earlier, I would make new cats for each wedding I did. When it was time to play the cake cutting song, I one clicked one tab and all the specialty songs I needed for that wedding were right there. When it was time to play music again, I one clicked one tab and all the sings I had pre-selected for that wedding dance were right there. It is faster than the system they have in 1.90 and when you have to quickly switch from one cat to another you can't beat 1.85.
This sounds very much like what a work area is for, or in 1.90, it's called prepare. I have found adding songs to a work area very handy in the new upgrade.
Quote from: Darryl on August 07, 2012, 06:48:39 AM
It took me a while, but I've finally found a way to script the OMQL field - so when one of us gets a chance to write an AHK file, you can have whatever buttons you like (categories or more advanced queries like only karaoke, only video, anything other than karaoke and so on).
Hey Darryl,
Could you explain more how this works? Are you saying it is possible to have a cat selector display like this...?
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/58821555/Ultimate%20ESP%20Screen%20Interface%20designed%20by%20Phil%20Spinner.jpg
Does this help????
http://youtu.be/LsRwbE6msJk
Quote from: Artist formerly known as 'Jumpin' Jeff' on August 08, 2012, 02:58:38 AM
Does this help????
http://youtu.be/LsRwbE6msJk
This does help. How did you get the cat selector to appear on the screen like that? How do you add and delete cats to that display?
There are things which are much quicker in 1.90.
Ctrl+A selects all now in the library, playlist, karaoke and history areas, rather than right click and select all. Ctrl+C and Ctrl+V too to copy and paste on the Search and OMQL areas. One shortcut might be to type a cat name you use often then right click to copy. Then you can right click to paste the cat name into the OMQL area each time you want to go back to it, rather than type out each time.
Having got used to the look of 1.90, I went back to look at a 1.85 Webcaster licence I also have last night. It really does look dated now by comparison.
Hi Dub2Dat, had a play with Darryl's script, couldn't get it to do all what I wanted, but here is something to play with. Just put your Categories in the Cat.ini file (up to 16) and away you go.
There is an CatButton.exe (you don't need AHK to run it) as well as CatButton.ahk script. Anyone feel free to fix up script!
regards ken
That's excellent kenmax, nice work. Thanks
One thing - it doesn't handle multiple word cat names such as "Rock Playlist" either within quotes or without, but nice all the same.
One thing I think is neat, although I thought it was a silly addition at first, is the turntables. For those of us who remember records, it gives a quick indication of where in a song Ots is playing. The strobes are cool, too.
Quote from: kenmax on August 08, 2012, 01:48:28 PM
Hi Dub2Dat, had a play with Darryl's script, couldn't get it to do all what I wanted, but here is something to play with.
Excellent stuff Kenmax! That was exactly what I was hoping for - some one to come up with some ideas - my script was to help you get going. Thanks.
Quote from: JohnnyTheFox on August 08, 2012, 02:09:10 PM
One thing - it doesn't handle multiple word cat names such as "Rock Playlist" either within quotes or without, but nice all the same.
That should be reasonably trivial to fix in the script - just add the quotes around the variable in the SendInput/SendPlay call. If kenmax doesn't beat me to it, I'll do it for you tonight.
I've had a little play with Kens version, and I've been happy with it's current ability to handle multiple commands like Pop&Rock or BPM>120&BPM<140, however, it doesn't handle spaces such as in 'New Music'. It needs to be a literal string for that to work. If you make it a literal then he combos like 'Pop&Rock' no longer work.
It's definately a step in the right direction.
Spotted a couple of things in the OtsAV 1.90 / 'Esperance' Complementary Documentation
More customization options are arriving in future 1.90 series updates, including further colour options.
.....and just to prove the Ots guys know what they are talking about :laugh:
In OtsAV 1.90 the caret takes on a special meaning: it allows you to search by two fields simultaneously, and both must match for any given item in your library to be considered a match. For example you could type "beatles^love" and you're most likely going to see a list of Beatles songs with the word 'love' in them, that is, unless you didn't like Paul McCartney's performance at the London Games Opening Ceremony and decided to banish all Beatles songs from your library :/
Sadly, I am a little older and was not raised on computers. For those of us who are not computer savvy, half of what was said in the last several replies make no sense at all. I am sure they are great... I just wish it was in English.
1.85 was not a terribly complicated program but very powerful. I just hope they come out with the updated documentation on 1.90 soon so I can learn it and use it. For now I am DJing on my newer laptop that still has 1.85 and am leaving my older backup laptop with 1.90 at home. I won't use 1.90 until I can figure it out well enough to handle any spur of the moment problems that seem to pop up from time to time when DJing a wedding.
Since my newer machine with 1.85 is the one with the free upgrade to 1.90 I am a little worried that Ots will not finish updating the documentation before the deadline to use the free upgrade from 1.85 to 1.90 passes.
Quote from: Galager on August 08, 2012, 08:59:04 PM
Sadly, I am a little older and was not raised on computers. For those of us who are not computer savvy, half of what was said in the last several replies make no sense at all. I am sure they are great... I just wish it was in English.
1.85 was not a terribly complicated program but very powerful. I just hope they come out with the updated documentation on 1.90 soon so I can learn it and use it. For now I am DJing on my newer laptop that still has 1.85 and am leaving my older backup laptop with 1.90 at home. I won't use 1.90 until I can figure it out well enough to handle any spur of the moment problems that seem to pop up from time to time when DJing a wedding.
Since my newer machine with 1.85 is the one with the free upgrade to 1.90 I am a little worried that Ots will not finish updating the documentation before the deadline to use the free upgrade from 1.85 to 1.90 passes.
Basically only a few things have changed, it does the same as1.85 with a different layout, the search is different.
To be honest I dint think it needs full documentation because the basic functions are still there, if it was me I would get the upgrades now, but that is your decision.
Here is my variation of the OMQL query buttons...
http://youtu.be/aVkIfL6QaII
The window placement is saved in the registry on exit.
The Buttons.cfg file contains the query info for each button on a seperate line for editing.
I'm liking the videos Jeff (Was the software to capture them affordable? I think I've asked before, but I've got an awful memory for stuff like that because I've filled it with all this computer nonsense instead). I can't help but feel we are missing out on your dulcet tones (I think I recall you talking on one once upon a time) get on the mic and talk us through it!
Or you could ask Milky (he's probably a bit too busy though) - his voice is smashing.
LOL, If I talked, it would take much longer to put together. For a tut that's onl a few seconds, i's not worth digging out the mic and practicing my mic skills.
Im using Movie edit premium t capture a portion of the screen. Not too exensive.
Keep in mind when using the AHK category programs you may need to turn off UAC for Windows 7. I couldn't figure out why neither program would send the commands, then it dawned on me - UAC, a DJ's nemesis.
Quote from: Galager on August 08, 2012, 08:59:04 PM
Sadly, I am a little older and was not raised on computers. For those of us who are not computer savvy, half of what was said in the last several replies make no sense at all. I am sure they are great... I just wish it was in English.
1.85 was not a terribly complicated program but very powerful. I just hope they come out with the updated documentation on 1.90 soon so I can learn it and use it. For now I am DJing on my newer laptop that still has 1.85 and am leaving my older backup laptop with 1.90 at home. I won't use 1.90 until I can figure it out well enough to handle any spur of the moment problems that seem to pop up from time to time when DJing a wedding.
Since my newer machine with 1.85 is the one with the free upgrade to 1.90 I am a little worried that Ots will not finish updating the documentation before the deadline to use the free upgrade from 1.85 to 1.90 passes.
I concur. I have hardly understood a word of it!
Silver
3. The inability to widen the title or artist. I have, as we all have, different versions of tracks, I need to see which one it is I am putting in a deck. I find this extremely annoying. I have to say I will not upgrade until this is resolved, it's a big problem to me!
You can widen the Playlist and the media Library
Just remove the History at the right hand side at the top of the history just click on the X if you want your history back just click on the + next to prepare.
Hope this helps a little.
I note your point about the Cats but I find it simple to click on the arrow next to OMQL and show Cats, I think it was Kenmax who developed a programe to show cats all the time he recently posted it here on the forum.
Quote from: Jigger on August 09, 2012, 08:44:31 AM
Silver
3. The inability to widen the title or artist. I have, as we all have, different versions of tracks, I need to see which one it is I am putting in a deck. I find this extremely annoying. I have to say I will not upgrade until this is resolved, it's a big problem to me!
You can widen the Playlist and the media Library
Just remove the History at the right hand side at the top of the history just click on the X if you want your history back just click on the + next to prepare.
Hope this helps a little.
I note your point about the Cats but I find it simple to click on the arrow next to OMQL and show Cats, I think it was Kenmax who developed a programe to show cats all the time he recently posted it here on the forum.
Cheers young Jigger (long time no speak :) )
That has helped, I don't need the history available all the time. So, yes I can see all the title. One issue resolved. :thumbsup:
Cats, yeah okay, can see what you are saying, I was aware of that but still don't like it compared to the original. I suppose if I put them in order, when I open up the box 20 or so cats will show (not counted the exact amount) and that should pretty well do me for an evening. A bit more juggling around for each gig than I would have liked possibly but no major prob. :thumbsup:
Just the size of the controls now to sort and I could be upgrading.
Top chap, thanks.
Simon.
Simon
A few key board shortcuts may help you
Ctrl+P will start a track if none are playing
Ctrl+Shift+Right Arrow will play next track
There are more shortcuts available but the basic ones are helpful
Click on the Ots logo top left and click on control, when you get use to them they are good.
Quote from: Jigger on August 09, 2012, 09:39:21 AM
Simon
A few key board shortcuts may help you
Ctrl+P will start a track if none are playing
Ctrl+Shift+Right Arrow will play next track
There are more shortcuts available but the basic ones are helpful
Click on the Ots logo top left and click on control, when you get use to them they are good.
Thanks but as I said earlier I'm not that 'up' on computers and pretty much a mouse, point and click. I find short cuts hard to remember and get on with.
The only multi key command I've EVER used is Ctrl, Alt and Delete!
Quote from: Galager on August 08, 2012, 08:59:04 PM
Sadly, I am a little older and was not raised on computers. For those of us who are not computer savvy, half of what was said in the last several replies make no sense at all. I am sure they are great... I just wish it was in English.
I agree Galager. Its all Greek to me. I like the videos that Jeff posted. They help a lot. Please add sound and let us hear your comments. God bless the code warriors!
There are common windows shortcuts you can use almost globally. Ctrl+A to select all, Ctrl+C to Copy, Ctrl+x to cut, Ctrl+V to paste.... These are used in windows explorer, Office, Paint.... Virtually 90% of all programs out there.
Ots tried to make it easy by adding the tooltips, so it's easy to hover over a control, and let the tooltip refresh you on it's shortcut.
Now, I'm looking for a way to call the prepare, History, and Karaoke panels with a shortcut. I do believe if I can resolve that, I could practically leave my mouse at home.
Thanks Jumpin Jeff and Ken for for scripts for cats buttons. Getting use to new search in 1.90 but having the fallback of cat select is a god send. Even Jeff W. might like it :thumbsup:
Now can you do a script so I can have the ability to import a cd into OTSAV. I don't care what OTS Adam says this to me is a major oversight. Someone suggested using free turntables but 1) why should I need ANOTHER programme running and 2) every third track it plays OTS signature tune.
Quote from: mel garland on August 09, 2012, 08:14:34 PM
Thanks Jumpin Jeff and Ken for for scripts for cats buttons. Getting use to new search in 1.90 but having the fallback of cat select is a god send. Even Jeff W. might like it :thumbsup:
Now can you do a script so I can have the ability to import a cd into OTSAV. I don't care what OTS Adam says this to me is a major oversight. Someone suggested using free turntables but 1) why should I need ANOTHER programme running and 2) every third track it plays OTS signature tune.
I sympathise there Mel. CD import and the ability to auto mix one track to another with that single CD in the drive was the first thing in OtsDJ that really blew me away, and sold me on the program straight away back in 2004. How OtsDJ did that seemed like some sort of black magic to me :laugh: and whilst I didn't the feature latterly, I can see it is really important at a live gig to be able to play a CD on the fly. I am sorry to see it go.
I've ripped many a disk in Ots Studio at a gig - I don't see it as a problem personally, but I can appreciate how annoying it is when when something you've got used to is taken away. I think this was a poor decision on Ots Labs part too.
Darryl I am always a bit worried about ripping whilst doing a gig and also 1) I don't or won't want the tracks in my libray (ie songs that got swearing in it) and 2) how would you stand on copywrite?
I never used the CD feature in Ots primarily because unless the drive was rigoruosly tested, I couldn't trust it to work as desired. If the SATA bus stumbled, or another drive on the SATA cable wanted attention, it would cause me glitches, so I opted to never use it for CD playback. I always riped to Ots, and imported on the fly, as that was always more work, but much more reliable. To me, it's no great loss, and I've never recommended it's use anyhow.
Sorry Mel, No way to script the missing code back in. ;)
Quite often I rip a few CD during the gig. Most likely these were last minute bought to fill the gap with brand new hits everyone is asking for. Since the big console is having the song repository on a NAS, it's no problem to copy the new albums from another notebook to that place. Just refresh the prod system and there you go with the hits. No glitch, not much of disturbance for the DJ besides the refresh.
Having an extra CD player on a gig is generally a good idea. It will act as a backup solution, in case your computer or soundcard has a problem. Loss of electricity might crash your computer in case it isn't a notebook with a good battery or UPS backed up.
Personally I wouldn't rely on the computer CDRom as a CD player during the gig. You never know what the OS sudddenly does.
I've never used Ots to play a CD live. I always bring two laptops to a gig. Both have OtsAV on the them. I use one as the primary system, while the other has Ots loaded up and ready to go in case there's a problem with the primary. Should somebody bring me a CD -- and I know what's on it -- I rip it in the backup machine and then use a thumb drive to shuttle it between the two laptops, then import it into the primary Ots system. Takes just a few minutes. Of course, if you don't know what's on a CD you should audition the track(s) first in case the song contains profanity or there's a physical problem with the disc.
I'll rip during a gig, the trick is to do it in a group where no one knows it's you.
:blusha: :p :laugh: :stuart: I kill me!
Quote from: Darryl on August 09, 2012, 08:31:04 PM
I've ripped many a disk in Ots Studio at a gig - I don't see it as a problem personally, but I can appreciate how annoying it is when when something you've got used to is taken away. I think this was a poor decision on Ots Labs part too.
There are sound reasons why we made this decision and if you were privy to them you wouldn't think it a poor decision at all ;) Sure, for the very few (our research indicates less than 0.1%) who were actively using this specific feature, they will have to adapt. But actually, that's a good thing because as Jeff said, stability and reliability can not be guaranteed due to the mechanical nature of CDs and the SATA bus. It certainly was an incredible feature for its time and in the vast majority of cases worked extrememly well indeed. But it has outlived its time. No one virtually is using it.
Some people tend to mourn the loss of anything at all, even if it's merely a perceived loss. But they will be fine :) All relatively recent versions of Windows; 2000, XP, Vista, 7 have progressively removed legacy functionality that just wasn't feasible to support any longer, nor was there any significant demand for. Windows 8 will be no exception. Sure, a minority usually jumps up and down, but do you really expect Microsoft to keep supporting legacy DOS games in all modern versions of Windows? Just run a DOS box emulator! Simple. Same with Ots and our CD-DA functionality. The cost of maintaining/re-implementing it in our new code base would have far outweighed any perceived value to 0.1% of customers. Would that be a wise decision? Anyone who really wishes to play CDs live at a gig via their PC still has options, even using Ots software. So it's no deal breaker, really. Also remember that no one is forcing anyone to upgrade. You can keep running an earlier OtsAV version if that is your preference just as you can continue to run Windows 98. We're not stoppin' ya!
Even some of those lamenting the loss here readily admit they never used it... Kind of makes you wonder!
Cheers,
Adam
Thanks Adam for your reply so I'm the 0.01 who uses this function :ohmy:. So what you are saying is use another ots product (free turntables) to play a cd whilst using OTSAV at a gig. 1) the free turntables play the OTS signature tune every 3 third play so not what I want and sorry I'm not buying it (would accept a free paid copy mind :icon_lol:) 2) If ripped in studio can I play the track in OTSAV without important it to the media libray? The reason I ask is some of the tracks I'm asked to play is not suitable for main gigs.
have to say that i'm also struggling with the Cat's, maybe it is one of those things that in time becomes easier....but scrolling through that long list to enter something that could have been on a button previously seems daft ( initial impressions ). Being a muppet i tried to load Kens .exe but ended up with 16 boxes saying ERROR....no idea what went wrong with that !
anyway, not sure if here is as good as anywhere to ask this question.....
if i pull up any Cat withgin that now as well as individual items there are albums. Is there a way of disabling that function? in the past i might bring up a Cat like 'party' and throw the whole lot (drag ) into a playlist, now if i do that i end up with stuff that isn't relevant to that Category - because it's dumped the rest of the album in there? Example Abba. Shows up with about 7 items in 'party' as does the album greatest hits - so when i drag 'abba' across i end up with a load of tracks not pertinent to 'party'......
cheers
mark
TBO, you could compensate several ways. Before Ots had video, I ran Media player to play videos. and I'd simply place a stop and recue in Ots playlist, and manually mix the video with media player. Nothing stoping you from using Media player or itunes to play an occassional disk track. If you're playing more than one track at a time, then a paid version of turntables might be more in line with your needs.
Just some thoughts.
Used 1.90 at a gig last night.
Yeah, it's pretty darn good for the way I use it.
and I haven't even gotten used to most of the keyboard short cuts yet. I wasn't using the old existing keyboard short cuts as much as I should, but certainly see the benefits of using them, plus with the additional ones, it's great.
found myself using the ^key, the DEL key a lot...those things are huge!
Well after all my testing and playing around with the new version I still love the old version for simplicity and practicality. It seems more like it was made for radio jockeys. As you know I have 2 x HC-4500 consoles and have noticed that the new OTS OHML version does not have the sync buttons enabled. Do any other HC-4500 owners notice this? Is this right? or am I doing something wrong here. I suppose I could drop my own file in there but it does not have the looping codes.
used it for two gigs now and I absolutely love it. Mind you I also read up on everything first to make sure I understood what was going on. The search features are so so much better. I read the first two pages on here and skipped to the end but I saw several complaints were because they didn't read the update manual yet. There is no need to look for the categories because you just type them in the first section and then you can search or just look under that category. No need to click around. I was upset about that at first. Once I read and understood it I was like ..... oh that does make more sense than before haha.
Also if those who read will understand that the loop buttons were never intended to be clicked but for your controller to use. But, until then obviously we do have to click them. But yeah they work good. Basically it looks like an interface overhaul, a search and organization overhaul with a sneak peak at the looping. Nothing huge and nothing that I think we should have waited an extra year for. However, it looks like all the back end work is being laid out that we can't see yet. So I'm very happy it is out, and I like it a lot, can't wait to see what other updates they have planned. So far this was worth the wait. Would much rather have 1.9 than 1.85 :D
Quote from: DJ Postie on August 10, 2012, 11:17:03 PM
[Edit] I have 2 x HC-4500 consoles and have noticed that the new OTS OHML version does not have the sync buttons enabled.
Press Shift/Back + Tap/Sync
Ran it for twelve hours at the time all last weekend to prove what I already knew,Rock Solid. Used it on wednesday night and it was flawless. If OTS will make the decks bigger or sizable and map it for the mc6000 I'm good to go.
BJ
I had an issue... with my laptop, NOT OTS... sorry if you were holding your breath. I had a Dell XPS Ultrabook that has a weird problem. When you use the trackpad while on battery, it works fine. If you use the trackpad while the laptop is plugged in, it's all glitchy. I googled it and I'm not alone. Luckily, I was able to return the laptop and I bought a new Macbook Air 13" with 256gb SSD. I tried using a few different Windows laptops, but I am a Mac guy, so I'm a bit spoiled. As far as Esperance goes though, it ran flawlessly at last night's gig... now I have to get ready for tonight's... :)
Quote from: mel garland on August 10, 2012, 02:04:27 PM
Thanks Adam for your reply so I'm the 0.01 who uses this function :ohmy:. So what you are saying is use another ots product (free turntables) to play a cd whilst using OTSAV at a gig. 1) the free turntables play the OTS signature tune every 3 third play so not what I want and sorry I'm not buying it (would accept a free paid copy mind :icon_lol:) 2) If ripped in studio can I play the track in OTSAV without important it to the media libray? The reason I ask is some of the tracks I'm asked to play is not suitable for main gigs.
Hi Mel,
Download our CD Scratch software. It is free. It has no audio overlays. It just plays CD.
www.cdscratch.com
That should solve those situations.
Ots_Steve
Don't like it. I used the categories all the time and now it's a pain. They should have given peeps the option to use the old skin as VD do. I now only use ots when i need to go to the toilet which is where the new ots belongs.
I am sorry you feel that way. We don't mind constructive critism,but your comments are unfair and unfounded if it is only the cats you have a problem with.
Judging by your post you are using something else now, Good luck if it meets your needs no need to slam Ots. You could have just said you didn't like the new version no need for your additional comment.
As I said previously, I really have no big complaints about the new release. It is still a great OTS Labs product! I feel in due time there will be an upgrade to the color theme choice (dark or light) and some other minor issues. In fact, I have grown accustomed to the new look and finding it rather nice! I really like the new search and time indicating when songs were last played...will not be going back to 1.85
That's one thing I don't really like, Ed. I would rather have a HH:MM:SS display in the History tab like Ots historically had. Is there any option I missed to have the History display the old format?
Otherwise, I've slowly warmed up to Esperance. I continue to be perplexed, however, at why it took so long to deliver.
Overall good. However, the playlist and library artist and title lists are too narrow to be able to see the long song titles and artist names ie you cannot resize the columns in the Media Library, although this could just be on my small 15" 4:3 monitor, has anyone ran it on a bigger screen?
I run a 23" widescreen LCD monitor at 1920x1080 resolution, and in full screen mode I can read every song title except 3, or any song title about 60 charactors or less with just the playlist and the media library lists showing.
The next version may address that issue DJ-MK.
I still think that the full title or artist should be displayed in a tooltip when you hover the mouse over an item.
Me too!
5 months into the new version. I really like it. the search and adding to list is amazingly easy.
sorting by most plays brings up the songs i want with very very keystrokes, then just hitting enter adds them to my list.
2 things I don't like:
5 months later and no updates to an unfinished version
$200 upgrade to a $300 piece of software. It's an amazing upgrade for free. Would be a well worth it great upgrade for something like $50. For $600 to upgrade other 3 licenses, it wasn't worth it. I understand they have a business to run, and I hope they do whatever they need to to keep the business running for a long time. If it is making the company more profitable, then that's what they should do. However, I do believe they'd make more money by charging a small upgrade fee rather than a fee that's 60% of the cost of a new license. If I extrapolate that over another few upgrades, each license could end up costing close to a thousand. For me, it stopped me from upgrading the ones I have AND has made me look at other software for new licenses as I can't have keeping software current being a major expenditure.
Quote from: scott hanna on December 21, 2012, 04:04:53 PM
5 months into the new version. I really like it. the search and adding to list is amazingly easy.
sorting by most plays brings up the songs i want with very very keystrokes, then just hitting enter adds them to my list.
2 things I don't like:
5 months later and no updates to an unfinished version
$200 upgrade to a $300 piece of software. It's an amazing upgrade for free. Would be a well worth it great upgrade for something like $50. For $600 to upgrade other 3 licenses, it wasn't worth it. I understand they have a business to run, and I hope they do whatever they need to to keep the business running for a long time. If it is making the company more profitable, then that's what they should do. However, I do believe they'd make more money by charging a small upgrade fee rather than a fee that's 60% of the cost of a new license. If I extrapolate that over another few upgrades, each license could end up costing close to a thousand. For me, it stopped me from upgrading the ones I have AND has made me look at other software for new licenses as I can't have keeping software current being a major expenditure.
I have 1.85 version and have not upgraded to Esperance yet. You mean to tell me that it will cost me extra money to upgrade from 2 licenses to Espearance @ $200 ea license?
To me honestly its not worth the upgrade. Ide rather use 1.85 then esperance. I really like the older one better. It seems that everytime I scan in music to esperance.. its makes my audio playing skip.
Quote from: DJArt (Baby Boomer DJ) on December 21, 2012, 04:44:07 PM
I have 1.85 version and have not upgraded to Esperance yet. You mean to tell me that it will cost me extra money to upgrade from 2 licenses to Espearance @ $200 ea license?
some yes. I have 2 licenses that got free upgrades, and 3 pro that do not.
Agree with you Joe, the upgrade did very little for me and introduced the tiny control buttons, but I'll continue to use Esperence.
However I think we need to hold back a bit on our appraisal until Esperence 2.0 is released and compare that with 1.85
Its going to be any day now, right?
I just bought a new laptop (Asus Ultrabook) the newest one with the FABULOUS display, 256gb ssd etc... anyway, I had to change the resolution DOWN from 1920 X 1080 to 1600 X 900 because on the higher res. display, the ots decks were so small, you couldn't ready anything. I like a lot of things about the new Ots, but honestly, the tiny buttons and the display in general isn't on my list of "likes".
Maybe Ots is developping on big 23 inch or more screens.
On these big screens everything is a little bigger.
Mobile DJs running from laptops only have 15 or 17 inch (full hd) screens, this is way to small for the current esperance layout.
I seem to remember from somewhere that the tiny buttons are their size because they're pushing using Esperance with a controller.
Flame away.
I'm not going to switch to ESP.
Swishing and scratching and stuttering and beat matching is not what my clients appreciate. They want a smooth flowing, event that moves and keeps their guests engaged and entertained.
The old ots allows me to be a better party DJ/Coordinator/Entertainer. For a 5 hour reception you only play about 3 hours of dance music. That's only 50-60 songs. I need to focus on the guests, the dancers and the party not a controller or another program just to play a CD.
I have always said that OTS is just a hammer. When a new hammer comes out that does a better job for me than OTSDJ I will switch. So far, that has not happened.
Plus, I'm too old to change...
Quote from: shdixon on December 27, 2012, 04:47:16 AM
Plus, I'm too old to change...
This brings up an sensitive question. Is OtsAv mainly used by 'old' DJ's?
I'm 52 and certainly not a dance/trance Dj like Tiesto. I do mostly weddings and parties with people between 16 to >60 years.
Maybe Jeff can see in the user database what the average age is of the users of this forum?
Just a question that came up, well it is a little of topic.....
Nice thinking, DJ Buik. I'm almost 64, and have been using Ots since I was about your age. Back then, I used to do weddings, engagements etc, but more and more, "parents parties". Ots was great for that. I never needed, nor learnt about beatmixing/matching etc, because my clientele didn't want to know.
Similarly, I also work in radio, and evolved from the REAL twin turntable era. Ots was a breath of fresh air compared to slip-cueing vinyl whilst chatting calmly on open mic. Twelve years later, I still use Ots in my home entertainment system, and love it, but I would not use it in any of the terrestrial radio stations I own and/or manage. I'm sure I could still manage a parent party or two, but would not want to try and stack up against the latest DJ tricks.
:rolleyes: Too set in my "old" ways to try and become a "turn tablest"...let the "younger" DJ be innovative, nothing wrong with showcasing their talents.
I'm older by several years than Milky and I agree that OTS does what I need it to do since I do mostly weddings and an occasional Sweet 16. Seriously, I don't need a bunch of "bells and whistles" to make me seem more knowledgeable; my music frame of reference does just fine. There is a knack to knowing what songs fit together from various years/decades.
However, I will eventually learn to use Ots Studio for creating my own personal "blend" of songs even though it is primarily for "beatmixing" in the Club arena, in my humble opinion.
Just wish that I had started DJ-ing earlier in life. :stuart:
I have no clue how to garner age info from the database.
I'm nearly 48, and all I can say is Adam Ots, as project director, is not that old. I think he's late 30s, maybe early 40s.
Quote from: Bryan Durio on December 26, 2012, 10:38:10 PM
I seem to remember from somewhere that the tiny buttons are their size because they're pushing using Esperance with a controller.
This may be true, but look at Traktor (not to bring other software into the discussion) but it is very easy to look at and supports controllers like the HC4500 without making the deck buttons tiny. I tried using Traktor in fact because they did a lot of things right, but Ots has done the more important things (for me) right, so here I remain.
I hear you Mike, This upgrade I would not have taken even if it had been for free. I'm sure its great and I'm sure that I had not even begun to look at all it could do. When they did away with Catagories and shrank things. It was not something I really wanted to deal with. I never minded the old look. But I'm not a fan of having to relearn something I knew how to use already. My full time job and our DJ Business is keeping me very busy. I'm not looking to add more to it.
They did not do away with the categories. They are still there. Just not as visible as before.
I am 56 and also like Stan, not into doing beat mixing etc at my events that I do. My clients want, like Stan said, a evening that flows well and keeps the dance floor active.
OtsAV is MY tool and although I have tested the other software on a regular basis, none of them do what my OtsAV 1.85 does...allow me to be a entertainer from "behind" the DJ booth (I actually seldom set up so that I am behind the DJ set up as I prefer people to be able to come up and talk to me), as well as entertain from the actual dance floor.
Until now i didn't see any comments from the 'young' (20+) DJ's.
I think OtsAv isn't the tool they choose, and they are not on this forum.
OtsAv 1.85 suites my needs very well. I wait for an Esperance 1.9x or 2.0 and maybe i upgrade.
Thanks for sharing your age, because i was thinking i was an old goat between all the youngsters ..... :happy:
With all respect, just kidding.
So, Esperance is for kids and the old version is for us heading to nursing homes...
I'm 62. I need one of those giant sized TV remotes. Heck, I don't need smaller buttons. I need the old OTS on a 40 inch screen!
I find no problems with the latest version, I would not go back to 185.
I can understand some of the concerns some have, and at first it was a learning cureve but I soon got use to it, Oh and I am silghtly younger than Milky only by a month or two 62
Like may things in life things do change, some you like and some you don't but usually I don't look back.
I'm nearly 38 (three days to go) and I find myself satisfied with Esperance - I do a little beat mixing but certainly not all through a gig - Ots AV has always handled itself superbly for unattended operation and I take advantage of that to go and converse with the guests early in the gig to get a feel for what they might want to hear. Then later I let it take over when I join them on the dance floor to teach them the routines to the classic cheesy dances.
Once the ice is well and truly broken then I'll beat mix a little (if it's appropriate to the crowd) mostly with the Promo Only intro edits on the latest DVDs.
Esperance has a couple of minor flaws (discussed here already): Size of fonts and controls for some users (large resolution laptop screens don't help users with poorer eyesight) and the scroll part of my trackpad doesn't work with the new list views. I don't consider either of these to be show-stoppers, just inconveniences.
All of the other features that you know and love are still present - they've just been moved about a bit. Some things are considerably easier to do in Esperance with the keyboard, but again that doesn't suit all users.
I suppose it comes down to the old saying - you can only please some of the people some of the time.
I have to agree with Dj Buik on the average user age that Ots would appeal too, every time a younger person comes to see what gear I am using I am more than happy to show them Ots but they just don’t seem to be all that interested? The first thing they want to see is how i spin the tunes like a vinyl record on a deck or to see what controller I am using, they get the fact that Ots is software but are put off because I do not use any external controller or even a mixer come to think of it.
I would like to see Ots come alive with more support for external controllers which I would then purchase, but I am happy to go with what I have for now…
PS Loving the new search functionality just took a bit of getting used to :rolleyes:
Resurrecting this old topic...
So it's been over 2 years now since Esperance was first released. We had a single minor update that gave us quicker access to the cats (Ctrl + Q), and got some new list colors for those that detested the total blackness that made their eyes tired.
Of those that are still here, and have posted in this thread already, but did not upgrade to Esperance, my question is, did you finally make the move to Esperance and see the light? or are you still sticking to 1.85.
Upgraded one computer to Esperance. The other (backup) is still 1.85. I prefer 1.85, but Esperance has some features that I like as well.
Went back to 1.85, and heard nothing to make me want to move forward. 1.85 meets my needs. It's Ots, so it is bullet proof. Until a real improvement comes along, I'm staying right here.
Would still be with 1.85 except had to upgrade one computer and after trying to get a computer that I could return to XP was a real pain so had to upgrade computer (Win8) to Esperance.
With the help of JJ and his OMQL buttons made Esperance work for the wife.. Non computer friendly so a good person to test on.
With JJs alternative I have been testing Esperance and yes it works for me in a non 1.85 way.
Whether we want to or not we all will have to use Esperance if upgrading to Win 8 or later unless there is an upgrade that is backward compatible with Mickysoft and looks like 1.85.
If you think that's going to happen, it will, just after you win the jackpot on the lottery..... :laugh:
Andy
I have been running Esperance since it was released and it runs like a tank on my Win 7 Sony Vaio. However, I will be using a HP win 8 laptop I recently purchased and that computer will be dedicated with only Ots on it, and all my music files 10,000 fit nicely on the 1 TB hard drive with a lot of space left.
I'm glad you're liking the utility Andy! Is that the actual OMQL buttons script, or the new OMQry Picker?
Herself is using the "Horizontal Buttons" and I'm playing with the Picker.
Still have two machines with 1.85 and I have used that interface for so long it's like the comfortable old coat and shoes, you know you should throw them out but they are soooooo comfortable.
I now use Esperance from a fixed booth with full size keyboard and mouse which make typing easier, my mobile unit is 1.85 with XP and being able to use mouse with preset query (&Rating>6&lastplay>28days) which I can paste into OMQL quickly and even modify it fairly fast. This is a 8 year old Acer laptop which will not be able to run Win8 so will be pensioned off when it decides to play up.
Pretty much like me, approaching 3 score years and ten and sometimes going out to a gig needs a family large crowbar to get me out of the door.
Hope you all have a good festive season and get all you want and more importantly want all you get. :thumbsup:
Andy
Sweet!
And the same to you and yours!
I switched my 2 licenses that included the upgrade. I like it. I like the updated search. I like being able to have songs listed by most played. Makes search and select quicker and easier.
However, I have not upgraded my other licenses, 3 that would cost about $600 to upgrade. There's nothing in the upgrade I found worth that, especially when I have to upgrade all 3 together.
I would have paid maybe $25-$50 a license, tops. I don't expect them to work for free. I do expect value for my money.
It was less expensive to buy 2 copies of VDJ. Those can be used on 2 computers each. So $600 for 2 computers and back ups.....or $900 to cover those same 4 computers with ots. But I'm not one to buy something because it's cheaper. I owned PCDJ originally, but bought OTS because it was simply better. Today, most of our DJs wanted VDJ and its features over OTS. I still prefer OTS over VDJ, but hardly anyone else here does. It's hard to justify paying more for something they don't want.
Somehow, VDJ has been able to stay in business while offering free upgrades and use on a back up computer.
The over promise and under delivery of the amazing new "Esperian" experience was disappointing as well. It was a fine upgrade, but the 2012 "finest vintage" stuff, along with long delays, releasing a product incomplete, with only maintainence upgrades in the last 2 years took a lot of the shine off. The meaningless karaoke tab I see all the time keeps reminding me of the incompleteness. It also reminds me of the upgrade years ago that they claimed would change everything. The upgrade didn't have many new functions.....but would make new releases come out much quicker. Didn't work out that way.
I still really like OTSav. I feel if they had dedicated some resources towards staying innovative in the DJ market, they could still charge for upgrades and make some money. But they've become an old shoe. Comfortable for those who have it, yet undesirable for someone looking for something new.
I don't pretend to know their business. They may be working very hard on some projects and could be growing leaps and bounds in other areas. But just looking at it from this DJ's perspective, they appear to be two dudes working on it occasionally whenever the surf isn't up.
I used to reccomend Ots to everyone. Today I don't. I do hope OTS decides to get back in the dj software biz some day. They were on the cutting edge before. They can be again.
I totally agree with the philosophy of not wanting to be everything for everyone. I believe in charging more than the average. But you must deliver much more value when you charge more. People who pay more..expect more.
Just upgraded my PC from XP to W7 and still running OTS 1.85. Mostly because I still have the Classic + free upgrade version that includes the scheduling part . If I go to Esperance, that will be lost. :(
But still works fine for me.
I am sure if you upgrade you will still have scheduling, worth checking though.
If you had the Classic +, Esperance is part of your upgrade path to version 2. However, I do see what you mean about the scheduling. That is really only available in the broadcast versions of Esperance, so would mean an upgrade to get that back. I really wish they had stuck with the previous model of plugins for video, scheduling etc. Add on what you want!
Indeed, when I upgrade (free) to Esperance I'll lose the scheduling part. I talked to the ppl at OTS about that and they confirmed that. On the other hand: I got the scheduling for free when upgrading to 1.85 or thereabouts... :thumbsup:
Quote from: Audioot on January 09, 2015, 12:31:31 PM
Indeed, when I upgrade (free) to Esperance I'll lose the scheduling part. I talked to the ppl at OTS about that and they confirmed that. On the other hand: I got the scheduling for free when upgrading to 1.85 or thereabouts... :thumbsup:
Hi Audioot and Jeff,
I can assure you, you definitely
will still have full scheduling functionality if you upgrade free to the 1.90 version with a
Pro-Classic+ [with free upgrades to 2.0] license. It has especially been put in there for Pro-Classic+ license-holders so they continue to benefit from that while they upgrade and take advantage of new DJ releases along the 2.0 path.
You should download DJ 1.90.015 now and enjoy (with scheduling functionality). :)
Cheers,
Ots_Steve
Cool Steve!
I always thought it was the reduced functionality scheduling that was in the normal DJ version. As I don't normally have need for scheduling myself, I haven't any experience with it personally.
Wow steve, that's cool. I'll need to check it out then... :stuart:
For as much complaining as I've done about the lack of updates, this is kind of ironic. I bought 2 New licenses on the 45% off. While my team all prefers vdj, I still prefer ots. On some machines now,vdj is on, and some old ots silver licences. I had to start a show for one of my guys and I didn't want to use either, so I'm putting ots 1.90 on other machines just in case I need to use those.
Vdj is fine, has a lot of cool features. I just prefer ots. Been trying to use vdj more around the house. Never at a gig yet
Quote from: scott hanna on March 06, 2015, 09:37:14 PM
For as much complaining as I've done about the lack of updates, this is kind of ironic. I bought 2 New licenses on the 45% off. While my team all prefers vdj, I still prefer ots. On some machines now,vdj is on, and some old ots silver licences. I had to start a show for one of my guys and I didn't want to use either, so I'm putting ots 1.90 on other machines just in case I need to use those.
Vdj is fine, has a lot of cool features. I just prefer ots. Been trying to use vdj more around the house. Never at a gig yet
Scott, milky said himself, if you have been a long time user of OTSAV, it's very hard to make a switch to another software like RadioDJ or Vdj....and he is right!
Quote from: Ed on March 06, 2015, 11:49:06 PM
Scott, milky said himself, if you have been a long time user of OTSAV, it's very hard to make a switch to another software like RadioDJ or Vdj....and he is right!
That applies to any software though. I have been sitting on a better CAD program for 2 years, cause this old dog doesn't want to learn new tricks. I bought it because my old program was being dis-continued, but it is still working, even if it is less efficient then the new program. I see the loss of productivity with the transition as a big obstacle.
With DJ programs you have to be very familiar wit hit before you go and use it live. I used to have no problem with the .OTS format, I see the benefits, and just thought it was no big deal. Today, I have a different opinion - I see it as a big barrier to new people using the program. SO you want me to not only use a new program, and also commit to this huge change over in my music library? And also maintain another library copy so it is compatible with all the other programs? Sorry for the majority of people out there it isn't going to happen.
Quote from: SoundWave on March 09, 2015, 01:19:53 PM
That applies to any software though. I have been sitting on a better CAD program for 2 years, cause this old dog doesn't want to learn new tricks. I bought it because my old program was being dis-continued, but it is still working, even if it is less efficient then the new program. I see the loss of productivity with the transition as a big obstacle.
With DJ programs you have to be very familiar wit hit before you go and use it live. I used to have no problem with the .OTS format, I see the benefits, and just thought it was no big deal. Today, I have a different opinion - I see it as a big barrier to new people using the program. SO you want me to not only use a new program, and also commit to this huge change over in my music library? And also maintain another library copy so it is compatible with all the other programs? Sorry for the majority of people out there it isn't going to happen.
Great, What I said is if someone, like myself, is very familiar with a dj software, in this case Ots, RadioDJ was something I was considering switching to, but after a better look, Ots is still better for me! Again, "To Each His Own"
Quote from: Darryl on August 01, 2012, 05:03:39 PM
I'm a little annoyed that the scroll function on my mouse pad no longer scrolls the lists.
However its nice to finally see a key change facility (something karaoke singers used to complain to me about not having).
Finally posted the registry key fix for this: http://www.otsusers.com/forum/index.php/topic,14550.msg143339.html#msg143339